Any advice on how to handle caring for a 78 y/o mother who is narcissistic, has dementia, hoards, chronically ill, and living with me?

@ Texasgal - think we could put your 92 y.o. with my 93 y.o. mom, since we both found out too late in life what narcissistic means!!!! And that they will NEVER change for the better, only worse and worse ....

And oh yes, someone said in this thread about how their narcissistic person "sucked the life" out of them..... that is such an accurate description. Anytime I do anything for myself, my mother who lives with me, acts as if she permitted it, albeit with that curl of her lip and negativity that flows out of her, and on and on, so that after the thing I did for myself, it took a lot of the fun and joy out of it.... and this is me in my 60's ..... no wonder I tried running away when I was 14.... I so clearly remember ...

Been living in my home for a little over a year because she has no family/friend support around her in her home 2-3 hours away... I am "the only one", and know that for HER it is best to have someone looking after her, but for ME, there are not enough anti-anxiety medicines in the world or prilosecs for GI issues caused by anxiety.......and within the first 6-8 months of living here wanted to go shoe-shopping and kept choosing high-heels and made me the "bad guy" telling her no, that if she falls and breaks a hip she'll be in the hospital and nursing home, etc etc.

Same woman who joked about how when she was pregnant with me 60+ years ago she fell down the stairs. .... and another time how she accidentally shocked herself in a socket... tell me she didn't want to end everything

Same woman who when she was first here made it clear she wasn't going to stay here if daughter's boyfriend was in house (nicest guy you would want to meet), and forget about trying to date and bring someone home (me)....

I finally, finally figured out why I was the "golden child", the "perfect child" which everyone in the family was sick of hearing about.... because " I " wasn't the perfect one.... the "perfect one" was my mother - I am merely that "extension of her" - it all makes sense now .... she never encouraged me with any of my jobs... I do contracting .... I gave up a chance a year ago to take a job that paid twice as much and within 2-3 years, I'd be able to retire with house paid off, and a bit of savings, and ironically have had time for her to do things together ..... she's never encouraged me or been happy for me because she does not know how and has no empathy and cares about no one but herself.

I think next time she talks about leaving to go back to her home, I'll take her. And I will write a list of contacts she can have when she runs into trouble.... the number for the taxi, the number for the grocery store for delivery, the number of some local home care agencies, because I will surely make sure the car is removed... there is nooo way she can be driving. I was partially worried about her going to her home and my telling her firmly that when she is ill, she will have to find her way to the doctor and do all of these other things because she said she is fine on her own, and already know that she would let others think that "poor her, her daughter won't help" ..... and if she does go to her house, then so be it.... I hope to have another 30 years left in my life, BUT, maybe I won't, maybe it will be a year, maybe a week, none of us knows, but I want my children to know that I am there for them, too, not 100% for my mother.... and I want them to know it's ok to enjoy life and live it to the fullest - I lost my husband/their father when I was 44 and they were teenagers... mom has just about "sucked me dry" and I want to have fun and happiness and good health with the rest of however long I live and participate in my kids' lives whenever we can get together.

Oh and now I guess it is time for earphones and netflix yet again :) Good nite all... thanks for letting me vent... I raise my glass of wine to all who are in this boat!

p.s. You know, it isn't my mother I hate.... it's my taking so so long to figu

I am not sure how somebody can put up with so much. We need to think of ourselves not just your mother. My MIL is also narcissistic and has dementia. I am glad we never let her move into our house she wanted to. She tries to guilt us into it by saying she is lonely. She does living in AL. She believes we should serve her and never go anywhere without her. We did use to go on vacation with her and her husband (now dead) but they did their own things. We did take her on a trip with just her and it was horrible but of course she does not see that. They only see how things effect them. She outright told us we did not have the right to go on vacation without her. I immediately booked a trip we were planning. She does not know yet. She can't or won't do much. I have tried taking her shopping or to some event but she is always sick. Except for dementia she does not have many health issues. Make sure you be strong we are starting to learn to put our foot down and not give in and you can too. It is too much of a tole on your health to care for somebody without any training especially a parent. I have learned to visit less but take her to doctors and go over to clean up once in a while.

One thing that is of upmost importance~Think FIRE.

I can RELATE! My mom, who just passed in August, was a narcissist, hoarder, who physically, emotionally and mentally abused me from day one, had dementia but was also an ALCOHOLIC!

To add to that, my sister is also a narcissist. My mom and sister hated each other. Have you ever been around two of them at the same time? A TRULY mind blowing experience that kept me on pins and needles for 50 years. The depths they would go to “get back” at each was deeper than hell.

Both of them tried to run my life, told me what to do and bullied me. They both intimidated me until I decided enough was enough.

I loved my mom because she was my mom. But I didn’t like her very much. Luckily for me, she moved out of state when I was 13 and I only had to visit her twice a year. But I did have to live with my sister, ugh.

My story is like most of the others so I won’t go into detail, but this is what I did/had to do when she couldn’t take care of herself anymore;

She lived in a different state, so it was a little easier for me. We hired a in home non medical care business. There were only 3 employees, so it was quaint and mom could remember them most of the time.

I was driving to her house weekly (3 1/2 hrs one way) to check on her and go to her Dr. appointments. I’d take her out to eat, etc. I had to stay in a hotel because of her hoarding, which got very expensive.

My sister, who resides in yet another state would go to moms twice a year. During her visit in 2017, she attended a Dr’s appointment with mom. ONE appt. I had been to at least 20. She decided (although we were 50/50 in the POA) that she didn’t like mom’s Dr, fired him and found someone else. Mind you, her MD is rated as the best geriatric Doctor in her state!

Sure, you can argue with a narcissist, but it’s a TOTAL waste of time. You can NEVER win, you are ALWAYS WRONG.

I am Bi Polar (just a little dysfunction in my family). I have been through YEARS of therapy and have finally found the right MD and the right meds. I am trying to get my life BEFORE Bi Polar back.

I realized the toll this was taking (because of the years of therapy). I was decomping quickly both mentally and physically. Something I can’t afford to do to my health.

I had already watched my dad die a long and grueling death. I suffered terribly and had a total meltdown. I couldn’t watch again. I had empathy for my mom, but we were never close and she had people with her 24/7. She was safe. (Or at least we thought so... I have another question under Home Care and Elder Abuse. It’s definitely something you should read if you are contemplating hiring help).
Mom sort of apologized, something I never thought I would hear. Something my sister never heard. I forgave her in my head.

Now that she is gone, I have forgiven her in my heart too. That is a MUST for all of us.Guilt? No. I went to moms house for Christmas last year and didn’t go back until July of this year, when we moved her into AL. She died 9 days later after being taken to the ER.

My sister was with her in the hospital. I chose not to go. Mom had suffered a major stroke and would never regain her consciousness.

My sister put the phone by moms ear and I told her I loved her, I’d forgiven her and attributed her for her finer qualities. I told her I would TRY to get along with my sister for she is all the family I have left. I said I knew she was coming back as a butterfly and every time I saw one, I would talk to it as if I was talking to her. I also included some of the things I didn’t like. I apologized to her.

My sister said her color came back, her heavy breathing slowed and her gurgling stopped while on the phone. She passed 6 hours later. After 50 years, I am FINALLY at peace!

PLEASE take care of YOU! Self preservation is just that, SELF!

*There are many self help books available if you cannot afford therapy to help get passed the past. BEST of luck to you.

You more than have your hands full. My first main thought is to take away the ability for her to buy anything. I have had to reduce ways my mother could purchase due to a host of financial mistakes and purchases. We have had many frank discussions. She mostly has it under control but I still frequently tell her she cannot have a blank check and when she requests one the amount has to be agreed to. She could easily wipe out the money in her checking account. If you can remove what may be of some value from her place that would be great and then I would get a dumpster as I imagine the rest is mostly worthless and your time and stress level will be affected. It took my husband and I 6 months to empty a one bedroom apartment. Some of the worse 6 months of my life. I truly hope you can take away the ability for her to continue to make purchases as difficult as that will be.

So much of what you share reminds me of my situation, a hoarding,narsasitic,paranoid,father with dementia who now must live with me after his stroke. My Father is also a hair over the income level. I think all states have have a program where the state a lots money for caretaking. In CA it is IHSS.I had to apply for medi-cal too and he pays me a share of cost. I toss the catalogs when they come in too. My Father is very narcisistic & controlling. If he could not control those around him, he would try to destroy them. I quit my job and took him in after he had a stroke because he was too much for anywhere he was put. He also would not sign a POA. If it was not for his stroke and his immobility I do not think I could keep him here. I am very impressed with the enormity of what you are tackling. It is very stressfull to the family. And while it feels like it tares at us, I feel it strengthens us too. When it turned out my father's cancer matastisized, it ended up giving us maximum 24 hr available support thru hospice. My Father being a vet we were advised to apply for a volunteer to come so many hrs a week! If you don't get state paid caretaking, you may be eligable for other volunteer caretaking programs. In our state it is just one or the other, so that it is not double dipping. Well my father has slowed down a lot and between his lack of strength and the education hospice does on how to medicate him for comfort and to ease agitation, things have become quite peaceful. He has been here over a yr and a half. He has alianated all the other family by how he has treated them or how they have observed him treating me, mistrusting and accussing me when I have sacraficed so much to care for him. What I really want to say is although your mothers judgement may be impaired some what, she is still a walking, talking adult. Consider letting her steer her own ship, even if doing so may be like letting her shoot herself in the foot. In other words if she wants to buy high carbs & sweets and put herself in a diabetic coma that is the way she wants to go. I would try and keep the hording to a minimum for your own sanity and safety, but she almost died once and is living on borrowed time. Let her live it the way she chooses. Maybe she will go out happy & quick steering her own ship on a sugar high :)! I know it does not sound very medically sound and my father was pre diabetic, but I was always adviced to let him eat whatever he wanted this late in the game.

I admire your efforts and it's a great thing you are doing but i think now you should handle her to a elder care center for they can take care of her better than you are doing and you can also concentrate on your career.

For starters, if she goes into hospital or rehab, refuse to take her back into your home.  Her care is simply beyond you - the simple truth.  And this is very unfair to your other family members - sounds like they are being made to live in a mental hospital.  Your mom needs to be placed - make that clear to discharge planner that she is mentally ill and you cannot care for her.   What is her doctor's take on her competency?  Could she be declared incompetent? Would you be willing to be guardian or rather leave that to the state? If you have the money/authority, get a service to clean out her apartment.  If not, report to health department - this sounds like a danger to others.Can you work with hospital/rehab social worker on the Medicaid application? They can sometimes be very helpful in making applications.
Final course of action is to see an attorney for legal ramifications and evict her.

I believe OP has left the building...

Please, please if she is driving, talk to her doctor - he or she should be reporting her medical problems with diabetes to Dept. of Motor Vehicles and yanking her license. Please save a life!

Hi, this isn't an answer. I'm sorry. I have the same situation o oh mom has dementia also. Can you tell me what the limit financially is allow for medicaid. She gets $1600.00 a month. Is that to much? I want to so
!y but fear she'll be denied. I live the same miserable life minus the hoarding. I hope you find answers. I'll be following. Good luck.

Hey There. I know I didn’t write this question but I could have. You, dear One, have a row to hoe. 😔. I would suggest you look up Dr. Ross Rosenberg on YouTube videos. He addresses the narcissistic personality disorder in depth. What he shares with his clients and how he trains his counselors is empowering for adult children of narcissists. I understand you are trying to do the right thing, but abusing yourself doesn’t sound like the right thing. Strength to you! VK

Hello again ...I would just like to thank everyone that responded to my OP. I appreciate you taking time from your busy day to offer another prospective and/or possible solution to the problem. Sometimes we can’t see the forest for the trees when we’re so close physically and emotionally to a circumstance. Sometimes we just need verification that our thinking is in the right place. So again ...may God bless all of you and anyone going through trials and tribulations ....and Thank You So Much...it meant a lot and was helpful.

I hate to say this, but sometimes you just have to let go. Let go of the control! Let go of wanting to help! Let go of trying to save someone who doesn't want to be saved! The bible tells us, " God helps those who help themselves".
My mother is the same as your minus the diabetic. However, there are so many things she is not suppose to eat but she does and I let her. She is the one who has to pay the price and she does! I try telling her what should not eat but it just started a fight, therefore, I have learned to pick my battles. Futhermore, I tried to help with her finances but she wasn't haven't it. Because she knew more than me, she was better than me; she had all the power when I moved in and believe me she let me know it to.
I just let go...now she has no money except her SS. So, now she can not afford to pay all the house bills, so I pay them. She does help, but I pay most of them and all of the up keep! Simply by just letting go! There is a book you might want to read called "Letting go" by David Hawkins, MD, Ph.D. It has nothing to do with dealing with dementia or hoarding. But it has helped me.
My mother is also hoarder. I just started throwing things out things that she would not miss, than I started to get her involved asking her questions like: what are you going to use this for? (This being whatever it was at the time) When are you going to use this? You get the idea. It worked for awhile but than I hit a wall & my mother started to fighting about it, so I let go. Months later she started to throw things away or donate things.
I know this doesn't sound like a good idea but it worked for me. You have to use some comman sense ( not let things go to far one way or the other)
However, you have gotten some good advice here. This is just another way to think about it.

There seems to be a common thread here about having a narc, hoarding & abusive mother,
so your not alone.

I pray that God helpes you find your way out of this mess and brings peace to you in Jesus' name. Amen

Bless your heart for all your kindness for your mother. I hope Medicaid can help soon. I had to go no contact after taking all the disrespectful abuse I could endure. Yes, it can literally take your own health and you have to take care of yourself.

Call APS...they did me a favor as I was completely blindsided by the sudden death
of Dads caretaker son,my brother,who never intended to go to any NH...but after
Brothers Funeral and Dad too much to care for incontinent,falling etc. I said whatever it costs as Dad only had 12,000 in his checking act....and he was admitted to a home to go on pending Medicaid as soon as I did a Funeral
Trust with his 10,000....it took two mos. all done by accident as I knew nothing
other than you must only have 2000 in your account...get the hoarding property
sold,declared, unoccupiable...then perhaps with Meds she will comply and never know why....how old is she Dad was 97...and very compliant..i visited everyday..

APS saved me from the initial call I made to a NH when I started panicing..
as the Assisted living just grabbed my Dads clothes from the ER due to my calling them from the phone book....I knew nothing about a senior having to be assessed by the hospital or Doc and I assume a vigilant nurse in ER was watching this lady attempting to take Dad after I wrote a check for 850.00
in the rooms in Er as she looked at Dads urine specimen, are you ready!!!!!
the check was towards 4800.00 per mo at an assisted living which Dad was way way beyond...long story short dad was kept in Hospital for 2 weeks
luckily with influenza and UTI...…..t.hen properly readied for long term care and the social workers found a NH for him...by the way priced at 7000.00 per mo
unbeknownst to me but going in with Medicaid.Pending,nosupplemantal ins. so after 20days full payrate.....161.00.. with the adult protective services
representative sitting with me as the first lady from the assisted living had taken my 850.00 from me as a downpayment illegally, she still managed to get her
recruiting of Dad up to the social services of the hospital never giving up recruiting my dad for her residence......IMAGINE THAT... I got half my money back after four weeks and I called the OMBUDSMAN...…...so APS is not always
bad they step in so you do not have to be the only decider...……..who is getting your Mothers social security now?is the Hoarding palace paid for?Is it worth anything?...or will it be condemned...…………………..
until he died 43/4 mos. later....