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would say that if she is aware and knowledgeable about the election and expresses a wish for you to vote ON HER BeHALF and as she directs you to, THEN it is okay. If you have to talk her into it, then no. Not even if you feel that you know how she would vote if she were able. And of course, not if she has no idea there is even an election nor the current issues and is even occasionally lucid. I do know absolutely who my dad would want to vote for..but i would not presume to vote for him , despite his being mostly lucid and able to express opinions, he mostly is withdrawn and sits and sleeps all day.
You don’t get to decide what is “ok”. You just advised the OP to break the law. Great way to get her mother’s ballot thrown own. https://elections.wi.gov/node/95
On the other hand, when I took my mother to vote after her stroke..which left her weak on one side but fully mentally competent. The poll worker was very abrupt and rude when all I did was walk her over to the booth and tell her how to close the curtain ..not even stepping inside with her. ( although I also saw him ask a black woman for her ID, which was the only person he asked the entire time I was there waiting with mom in the line). So consider he was not well informed with actual allowable behavior
Don't know about your state, but in my state poll workers (I've served as one) could and often did, explain the mechanics of both computer and paper voting. But they were not allowed to be present when the voter actually made their choices on the ballot. I think the "rude" poll worker may have feared that as a family member, you might attempt to direct your mothers preferences on the ballot, which would be illegal. She was taking her responsibility very seriously!
Dementia diagnosis DOES NOT MEAN INCOMPETENT. I am appalled at how many people state that it does. Mild Cognitive Decline/Early Dementia means that the person cannot transfer ALL MEMORIES or UNABLE TO RETRIEVE those memories. It is still debatable in the professional field as to how the Memory is impaired BUT if that person can still voice their opinion and has historically voted, then they should be assisted with voting.
ADVANCED DEMENTIA is another story. And NO...they should not vote because that is serious impairment.
"Can a POA vote on behalf of another person in a federal election?"
That indicates voting FOR the person, not assisting the person.
As to dementia, yes, early stages one might still be okay voting, but but but, that person would have to do it - someone can assist by requesting an absentee ballot and returning it and the actual ballot, and may assist if the person needs help filling it out and ensuring it is signed properly, but that help should NOT include "helping" them decide who/what to vote for. The person assisting would also have to sign the ballot, legally.
I gave an example where we had to update/add some legal documents when mom was in the early stages. The EC atty was able to take her aside, and question her, and in his opinion, she was capable of signing at that point. She would have been able to vote, most likely, but I did not assist her to get to a polling place, nor did I assist in getting anything mailed. She's beyond that point now. But, the point is that in early stages one may still be able to get through the voting process, however, again, the question was can a POA vote FOR the person - the answer to that is a resounding NO.
In the polling booth itself a voter if unsure of what to do in the booth a rep. Board worker 1 from Dem. 1 from Rep. (There must be one of each at each table ) and both should be in the booth to explain how to use, not tell who to vote for.
That certainly is not true in California. A poll worker is sworn not to discuss politics or help a voter needing assistance choose a candidate, but there is nothing that says poll workers must represent certain parties.
I would be VERY careful. If your mom's address is a NH and there are fights over ballots, I would suspect hers will get questioned. If she is not mentally competent, do not do this.
This is considered voter fraud and is a felony in this state. We do all voting by mail in this state and a signature is required. Several years back it was discovered a widow was voting for years on behalf of her very dead husband. Her excuse was he was a lifelong Democrat and she knew how he would have voted. ARGHH! Use your brain people. You know it is wrong.
You can’t vote on your mother’s behalf. It’s illegal in YOUR state. https://elections.wi.gov/node/95 you can however request an absentee ballot for her & have it sent to her at the nursing home & assist her with filling it out. She has to sign the envelope.
My father was mentally competent, but frail. Legally blind and in a wheelchair. I lived with him in an independent, age-restricted community. As I recall, I was allowed to enter the voting booth with him and assist in any way - but he cast his own vote. Never told him how to vote or who to vote for. I was his POA - cant remember if that mattered. He wasn’t in a nursing home, however (was in home-hospice care, though).
For worried in Cali...( they should really have a way to respond to relies on here) what I meant in my answer as to on behalf of ..was for them to fill out an absentee ballot according to the mother’s directions NOT just fill it out themselves or go vote for her ..reading the rest of my answer that should be clear and just an interpretation of “on behalf of” as filling out the paper
For Dosmo13 ..not sure why you tell me that they worker can explain mechanics and paper voting but not be present , and yeah I get that they need to watch for family member or others telling folks how to vote( although one response here indicated that in their polling place it was allowed with a group of mentally handicapped persons) HOWEVER as I said my mom had had a stroke and clearly needed assistance with mobility so I walked her to the booth and as I SAID I remained outside but since as I SAID she had weakness on one side it was difficult for her to close the curtain so I said to use her other strong hand ..which the worker was close enough to hear and (also as I said ) HE ..very loudly berated me ..causing everyone to look over, embarrassing my mom who was all ready self conscious enough, and although I did not say so his demeanor and language and body language was clearly RUDE..not just taking responsibility seriously. There was no reason to yell, he was close enough to touch me . I do believe that poll workers are supposed to be courteous and he continued to yell at me even though the curtain was closed with my mother inside it at that point and I had not said a word , being frankly shocked at his behavior. I said ..sir there is no need to yell, my mom just needs help walking. And he then tried to make me leave the room, despite that I said I needed to help her out...plus turns out she was having issues with strength needed to open the booth and we couldn’t hear her due to his screaming . Luckily another worker came over and spoke with him , and indicated it was fine for me to assist my mom with leaving . I have no idea what set this man off as I was polite and quiet the entire time. Also, his treatment of the black woman just emphasized that he was not competent in his job there. He almost attacked her as soon as she stepped into the room and prior to her getting to the sign in table where they normally make sure you are registered to vote in that area. Also, their neighborhood is by far majority white. I do know dude when I see it ,
Pollworker can explain how voting process is carried out, since some people are not sure how to do it. But they can't (unless rules have changed) actually participate in the voting. May be some accomidations are now made for physically disabled.
Even if you are certain how another person, even a very close relative or spouse, would vote, it is still ILLEGAL to cast a vote on their behalf. (And please don't vote on behalf of the deceased...the graveyard is full of "registered voters" who somehow are resurrected to vote in every election!) Sorry mymomsthebest has such an awful experience at the polls. It should not have happened. I did not mean to minimize her discomfort in any way by a previous post.
If you want to vote "absentee" (as it is called in most states) or help someone else do this, there is a specific and usually quite detailed, procedure to be followed. It must be applied for in advance. There is a deadline to apply and there are safeguards to prevent voter fraud. Consult your own city and state requirements.
So actually, there is at least a partial breakdown of semantics here.
For my part, I feel that my original comment represents what I believe, considering both legal obligations in my state as well as my own personal sense of ethics regarding my LO, that what I described in my original comment, would be correct in our situation.
Presently, it is likely that I would be unable to have conversation that would allow me to consider the fairness of allowing LO to express her wishes concerning her vote, because of the logistics of our meetings, still outside, social distancing, masking, typically on a patio surrounded by other families, residents, and guests.
As stated in my original post, I would never attempt to persuade any person one way or another. I am willing to bend the truth in innocuous situations regarding her care and comfort, but the sacredness of the vote is by no means subject to that tempering of judgement, and my own conduct dictates that I would act accordingly.
Summing up- “on behalf”? NO. As objective assistant in indicating OL’s choice? In consideration.
You may consider this a "picky" semantic point, but it applies to casting a vote for someone other than yourself.
"In behalf of" generally means literally and legally "as a representative of" or "in the place of" another person..
It's a fine distinction from "on behalf of", which is what a lawyer does when he argues in support of his client. He is not speaking in place of the client, but is speaking, as he is obliged to do, in support of his client's viewpoint.
Neither of these are legally acceptable ways for casting votes in a U.S. election. If you are interested (which is probably unlikely) consult both American and British English Dictionaries.
You may "help" her vote by requesting a mail-in ballot. You may not fill it in for her If she can not fill it in or is mentally incompetent, then it is better that she doesn't vote. If she has vision problems or problems with her hands, talk with the nursing home about having a worker from the polling place come to help the residents. If you "help" too much, the government may see it as you voting twice - which is a federal crime of voting fraud.
By proceeding, I agree that I understand the following disclosures:
I. How We Work in Washington.
Based on your preferences, we provide you with information about one or more of our contracted senior living providers ("Participating Communities") and provide your Senior Living Care Information to Participating Communities. The Participating Communities may contact you directly regarding their services.
APFM does not endorse or recommend any provider. It is your sole responsibility to select the appropriate care for yourself or your loved one. We work with both you and the Participating Communities in your search. We do not permit our Advisors to have an ownership interest in Participating Communities.
II. How We Are Paid.
We do not charge you any fee – we are paid by the Participating Communities. Some Participating Communities pay us a percentage of the first month's standard rate for the rent and care services you select. We invoice these fees after the senior moves in.
III. When We Tour.
APFM tours certain Participating Communities in Washington (typically more in metropolitan areas than in rural areas.) During the 12 month period prior to December 31, 2017, we toured 86.2% of Participating Communities with capacity for 20 or more residents.
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You have no obligation to use or to continue to use our services. Because you pay no fee to us, you will never need to ask for a refund.
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Please contact our Family Feedback Line at (866) 584-7340 or ConsumerFeedback@aplaceformom.com to report any complaint. Consumers have many avenues to address a dispute with any referral service company, including the right to file a complaint with the Attorney General's office at: Consumer Protection Division, 800 5th Avenue, Ste. 2000, Seattle, 98104 or 800-551-4636.
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I think the "rude" poll worker may have feared that as a family member, you might attempt to direct your mothers preferences on the ballot, which would be illegal. She was taking her responsibility very seriously!
ADVANCED DEMENTIA is another story. And NO...they should not vote because that is serious impairment.
"Can a POA vote on behalf of another person in a federal election?"
That indicates voting FOR the person, not assisting the person.
As to dementia, yes, early stages one might still be okay voting, but but but, that person would have to do it - someone can assist by requesting an absentee ballot and returning it and the actual ballot, and may assist if the person needs help filling it out and ensuring it is signed properly, but that help should NOT include "helping" them decide who/what to vote for. The person assisting would also have to sign the ballot, legally.
I gave an example where we had to update/add some legal documents when mom was in the early stages. The EC atty was able to take her aside, and question her, and in his opinion, she was capable of signing at that point. She would have been able to vote, most likely, but I did not assist her to get to a polling place, nor did I assist in getting anything mailed. She's beyond that point now. But, the point is that in early stages one may still be able to get through the voting process, however, again, the question was can a POA vote FOR the person - the answer to that is a resounding NO.
you can however request an absentee ballot for her & have it sent to her at the nursing home & assist her with filling it out. She has to sign the envelope.
The USA is wonderful accommodating people that can not see, yours is a perfect example of how our country accommodates the visually impaired.
But they can't (unless rules have changed) actually participate in the voting. May be some accomidations are now made for physically disabled.
Sorry mymomsthebest has such an awful experience at the polls. It should not have happened. I did not mean to minimize her discomfort in any way by a previous post.
For my part, I feel that my original comment represents what I believe, considering both legal obligations in my state as well as my own personal sense of ethics regarding my LO, that what I described in my original comment, would be correct in our situation.
Presently, it is likely that I would be unable to have conversation that would allow me to consider the fairness of allowing LO to express her wishes concerning her vote, because of the logistics of our meetings, still outside, social distancing, masking, typically on a patio surrounded by other families, residents, and guests.
As stated in my original post, I would never attempt to persuade any person one way or another. I am willing to bend the truth in innocuous situations regarding her care and comfort, but the sacredness of the vote is by no means subject to that tempering of judgement, and my own conduct dictates that I would act accordingly.
Summing up- “on behalf”? NO. As objective assistant in indicating OL’s choice? In consideration.
"In behalf of" generally means literally and legally "as a representative of" or "in the place of" another person..
It's a fine distinction from "on behalf of", which is what a lawyer does when he argues in support of his client. He is not speaking in place of the client, but is speaking, as he is obliged to do, in support of his client's viewpoint.
Neither of these are legally acceptable ways for casting votes in a U.S. election. If you are interested (which is probably unlikely) consult both American and British English Dictionaries.