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I am sorry for all those that had abusive parents. My mother was abusive, but not horrid. My father overall was simply absent. But I feel for my mother because I understand her life, and she has helped her children as adults. Despite the fact that she can be mean, she tried. Perhaps her best was not good enough, but she tried. I would definitely put my mother in a home in a heart beat if I was not afraid they would probably poison her. I hope all those that can, get help or get out of that situation.
Laws? No. but guilt and the feeling of family obligation, yes. But at some point you have to decide, what is gonna be best, letting these people kill me out of guilt and fear and family expectations, or letting them think I am a selfish miserable human being because I won't lay down and let em destroy what is left of my soul?!
She had you when she was 23 or 24 y/o, and was supposed to grow alongside with you. I guess there wasn't much of that, otherwise you wouldn't be so resentful after all these years. (Plus now you're having to sacrifice some of your life to take care of her.) Instead of the blissful childhood you hoped for, perhaps your mom resorted to regular doses of discipline to keep you on the straight and narrow. Still, had you come with instructions at birth, raising you would've been a lot easier.
It seems the roles are reversed now, but this is no time to contemplate payback no matter how stressed out you get. You do, however, need to find some closure. And you're not going to achieve this if you don't speak with her gently about these bottled up issues while keeping in mind she has a heart condition. Yes, you're having to forego a lot of things to take care of her and the resentment continues to fester within you. But remember that she tried to do the best she could with what she had. You're doing the same. She might not bring herself to admit it, but she's feeling guilty for not having been the mother you expected. At the same time, she feels grateful and lucky to have a daughter like you.
It's a tall order, but try to forget she's your mother for a moment and talk with her as if she were one of your girlfriends. Don't be crude, crass, obscene, and abusive. Channel all that resentment in a constructive manner and let the caring and nurturing woman that you are shine through. After all, your Mom must have done something right.
Be well my friend, and keep us posted. ... Inquiring minds want to know.
Yeap, but some people think I'm overly simplistic when I point out how blinded people are by the darkness of F.O.G. Fear of breaking family, parental, mom's, even religious interpretations and applications of the Bible. Obligation to be driven to fulfill these obligations as if we are still emotionally that little girl or that little boy. Guilt from either out own over active super-ego (the parent in our head), from society who often does not know the whole story, from family/parents/mom, and sometimes very concrete religious minded people. As Admiral Perry said about the obstacles before him said "dam the torpedoes, full speed ahead" and he won.
Crowmagnem you hit it on the head. My dad hooked up with a woman who kicked him out with no money. I limited the time he lived with me to just long enough to set him up in elderly housing. He moved out refused to eat and engaged in other manipulative behaviors which started to disrupt my household. His behavior such as not eating and calling the ambulance 17 times from April to June lead to a nursing home admission. He made the apartment life unsuccessful so he could wiggle his way into my home. I refused to let it happen and do not regret my decision to seek guidance from social services regarding his issues. I felt like he was trying to die on my watch to promote guilt but thank goodness for outside assistance and the smarts to accept it.
There are two different kinds of abusive patents, the ones that hurt us as children and also the ones that become abusive when they get older and are sick. I went through both. My own father was abusive to me. When my mom came down with TB many years ago and she was sent to a special hospital and I was very young. I could not understand why my grandmother did not want me to stay with him. It was not until I was a grown up that I knew And found out many things my own father did to me. My mom became very abusive when she came down with alzheimer's. But I new she was sick. I took care of mom until she passed away last year. There is no law that you have to put up being beat or abused. but when a person is sick and there was never a problem yes you try your best. Today's world children are more aware of things, people who are in there 50's sometimes did not understand what was going on. I will never forget the things my own father did to me , he passed away a long time ago, but I never forgave him.
A few decades ago, there was let loose among us baby boomers the "recovery" movement. Not only the mainstreaming of alchoholics anon concepts, but the unmasking of parental sexual, emotional, and physical abuse. And to top it all off, the "diagnosis" that spouses and family members were "codependent" for trying to help (ie, control) the addict. If this forum were available back then, we'd all be calling each other codependents, and trying to recover from our caregiving addiction, our need to be in control of another's life. (sigh)
You don't know how many meditation groups I attended then where a majority of the women were trying to over come being raped by their fathers when they were young...they were SURE of it...well they suspected it. Why else would they feel the way they felt about men and stuff. Then there was the backlash of the "false Memory" movement.
Regardless of how the movement got out of hand, I think some of those books and concepts would be helpful for us caregivers. Suggest "In the Family" by John Bradshaw (which was a wildly popular PBS TV series) and "Codependent No More" by Melodie Beattie. Once you get your hands on those books, there are others to handle more specific issues.
I still say that forgiveness is the key. I know that in spite of the abuse from my mother and the other things that happened in my life which were a direct result off that and the wreckage of my life that followed, I feel that I have been given an opportunity for reconciliation with my mother as well as within myself. Sometimes one can find no reconciliation with a parent. But often times, what I have seen working in nursing is that there often is a reconciliation that takes place before the parent passes away. That parent wants to make things right with that child in some way or another ~even if they can no longer speak. Forgiveness is important. It is more for us than it is for the person who hurt us. It's not so much that it lets the other person off the hook, but it lets us off the hook ~the hook of anger, bitterness and resentment. Forgiveness is not necessarily easy, but once it begins it brings a healing with it to so many areas of one's life. Ask me how I know...
Stacey, until recently I would've bristled at your idea of forgiving my mom. I had a hard time understanding what exactly forgiving her meant. No way did I want to say it was ok for her to have been mean to me my entire life or it was ok for her to recently disown me or it's ok to have cared for her and now have no contact with her except through her lawyer. With the help of Crowe, I finally saw the light and realized that forgiving mom would lift my resentment, anger and sadness. Call it forgiving, moving on, letting it go,whatever works for you, but I've done just that. Mom's behavior towards me and my kids is now being handled by God. We didn't make her hateful and we can't fix hateful. I do not ever see a reconcilliation with her. The minute I decided to put it behind me, I felt a huge load lifted. I am no longer responsible for the ugly words, actions or deeds she doles out. It's very sad to have a mother like mine and even at my age, it hurts me deeply to know I got the short end of the stick having her as a mom. I'm letting go and moving on.
Some of us didn't ever forget the abuse so it didn't need to be "recovered". I had all the Bradshaw books and forgiveness didn't change a god damn thing or make me feel better or holy, so I un-forgave, it is a meaningless concept to me.
You are very right that there are two different kinds of abuse.
I'm not sure how much more today's children are aware than we are more willing to face such things and talk about it as well as we have teachers and school administrators who are supposed to watch for evidence of this kind of thing.
My wife's mother should have been arrested long ago, but one problem was the isolation living in the county where such abuse is hidden easier.
Speaking of becoming aware of things in your 50's, what my mother covertly did to me as a child, and teenager is something that I've just had my eyes opened to within the last 3 years and it explains so much about my entire life.
AlzCaregiver ,
I deal with co-dependency myself and it flows like blood on this site!
It is a hard thing to do to go your own way especially to choose to do what is right and not just continue the abuse, just trying to remember I am an adult and I choose my behaviors and I don't want to be the selfish hurtful person my father was or my mother is becoming and hope to die young, so I don't go mental on someone in my old age as well.
It truly is a different age in the sense of teaching and awareness of abuse issues, but it is still going on and the cracks children the new generation of child abuse victims slip through is actually wider than you think. When workers at The PENTAGON get busted for child porn and teachers and educators are routinely arrested for inappropriate behavior with students and the on going plague of incest and family abuse continues, it is clear some how all the inner healing work and family therapy and educating of children and teens about being safe is not a total success. I think the education needs to continue and focus on adults, who are either so delusional they think they are not doing anything wrong or somehow think their situation is different. try and stave off some of the resentment to come.
Our use their children as emotional partners when their own marriage is sour or they are a single parent with an opposite sex child. I contend there is a whole lot more emotional incest out there than just the kind we normally think of.
Where do you think social workers find the most of this crap? Among sub-sections of the population who are big on control and particularly the control of everyone in a family. And it's worse in these country areas vs the city because it's like they have no concept of a healthy boundary even among relatives.
I have heard it is in every strata of society, whether rich or poor and all races and levels of education, all religious denominations etc. child abuse is like some human sickness we can't seem to shake off no matter where or who or whom or when even, educated or not it is just so common it is almost invisible.
May I suggest again that those who appreciate this sort of discussion, and hearing words of wisdom to heal...that you hightail it to Facebook (even worth signing up for an account just for this) and reading through the posts of Clarissa Pinkola Estes, PhD, author of the million seller "Women Who Run with the Wolves." She is back out in the world after being in a cave writing for ten years, and she is out swinging.
I get whacked daily by her stories and words. She has the power to blow off some of this old crusty junk we've all been carrying, with just a story or a few words. Warm enjoyable and refreshing ... and a lot of gals there guys! ;-)
I still think that healing can happen with a poem, story, movie. Not that the whole shebang is healed over, but one is standing facing a new direction. She is an artist at this...and she's worked with hospice hopsitals, etc. vets. you name it. quite a powerhouse.
Calla, i CAN TOTALLY RELATE TO U!!! I had an extremely hard and inconsistent childhood, if you read my profile susanT8403 you will understand exactly what I mean! its hard to do but when I put things into perspective, I have to think about what kind of upbringing my mom herself got! Not a good one, she had no reference point, and no manuel to take care of me, and I am an only child, still dealing with the demons of the past, with my mom, now I am her caretaker, and have learned to let go of all the resentments, as she was just so co-dependant,and into self she had no clue,I always promised myself, I would never be a mom like her! But in some ways I do see its head rear itself and I hate myself for it! unfortunately what they say about fruit doesnt fall far from the trees is so true! and this happens with me fighting it, getting depressed over it, and still find myself trying to get her approval in so many ways.........Its a struggle,but to be the bigger and better person, and to feel better about myself, I have forgiven her for all of it, and now I see how the quilt in her come out in so many ways it isnt really funny,but just keep on trying to overlook and bypass the past, because I know it is virtually impossible to get rid of it completely, I have to just be the loving caring mom I have always wanted her to be! and believe me she is so grateful for that! She respects me more now than being scared of her, and letting her push my buttons all over the place! I actually am not a doormat anymore! I will not condone, or let anyone overstep their boundaries with me! especially her, and since I have come to that decision things have been totally great between us, she respects me, and doesnt spew things to hurt me anymore on a regular basis, also, not only did she kick me out when I was a child but did the same thing all my life, even while I was in college with no where to go...........Now I am always worried that Iwill lose the roof over my head...........it is an undertandable fear though..........I have panick attacks as well, but those are getting better too! Hope all goes better with you, keep us posted! Hope this helpeda bit!
How can we live like this? It is insane. Rich people bitch about not having enough closet space and we worry about living on the streets after destroying ourselves to care for family members who may or may not have cared for us in their own personal hells of degeneration and aging and illness.
Insightful contributors: Jsomebody and Crowe, as well as Patrica61.
Mental Illness is still the number one most prevalent problem in this country, and probably the world, I don't know.. Abuse, Bullying, Rampant so-called "Discipline", and Nasty Criticism are all forms of mental illness. We don't label it as such, but that is what it is. The problem is how to deal with it. Each of us has our own way of dealing with mentally ill people. I think that the best way to deal with it is to dimiss yourself from the source. It may seem cruel, but you have to save yourself. If it were a serious communicable disease, contagious and spreading, would you stick around? No, of course not. So, why not dismiss yourself from the source (s) of mental illness......mentally ill people?
I know we were are the subject, of dealing with previous abuse from parents or love ones. When a person comes donw with a illness like alztimer's/dementia it is a different kind of abuse they are passing on. When we things happen in our lifes sometimes we then remember other memories that we did not remember or wanted to forget. As far as taking care of someone who is mental ill you may have to get out side help for them and also your self. We all have hidden secrets that we may not know about we try and deal with them. The past is the past. you can not change certain things.
Mental Illness in the form of personality disorders are contagious diseases. The pop lingo for some problems people get who are in a relationship with such a person is fleas. You can pick up personality disorder fleas without even realizing, but having a therapist can serve as your flea color or flea treatment.
I could say more about child and spouse abuse, but I must bite my tongue on that one or I will EXPLODE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I'm surprised how LITTLE these topics are discussed here. It's all in terms of being mean or nasty or due to dementia. But there are real mental illness out there and personality disorders. Add old age and dementia and then who can tell what is going on? Glad the lid was pulled off on this one.
I think since I got here last fall, we have had more and very open discussions about both BPD and NPD. We could use more on other mental illnesses than just personality disorders. I wonder what my bipolar disorder will be like in old age if I live that long? Sometimes, I'm not even sure that i want to live that long.
Dear CalleLilly, God Bless you in caring for your mother. I too am caring for mom, I'm a middle child and also not her favorite. Thank God my dads alive too and as I'm caring for him too, he's mentally healthy. And he helps defend me where my mother will accuse me of stealing or going through her personal things, when I've never even thought to do such things. So I try to reason with her and assure her I would never do anything to hurt her or trespass in her things. Now, how I mentally get over this heart breaking attacks from her ..... is to pray and give it up to God. I know you may think that's baloney, but it works. As I have been ready to pack my things and never see her again forever, I would only hurt my father and she still wouldn't understand. But GOD has pulled me through, pulled me UP, and now when she attacks, I'm cool, It's cool, and I forgive her, give it up to God to deal with and totally let it go. I have a five year old that I adopted from birth, and believe me my hearts ripped out when she attacks anything about my baby. And again immediate prayer and surrender and forgiveness heals the wound and allows me to once again show her my love through Christ. God Bless you and I'll hold you in my prayers.
Calla, I don't know whether you are caring for your mother in your home or arranging for her care in her own home. My advice for you in either case is that in order to keep yourself balanced enough to continue doing the job of looking out for your mother's care, you need to set limits to preserve your own physical/mental health. I respect you for caring for your mother in spite of your feelings of resentment., left over from childhood and so forth. You know what your limits are....If you care for yourself by honoring your limits, and only doing so much for your mother, you will be able to keep this set-up going and help your mother as she ages.
We've been through this before, Crowe, so here goes my take on Mental Illness ( Upper-case, mine). All mental illness are NOT personality disorders. The conditions that rank as P.D. are extremely serious, as you know, and require special skillls to treat. Some P.D.'s can never be "cured", just dealt with. If you know, or are living with someone who has been diagnosed with a P.D. , it is best that you do not try to solve their problems, or even take them on. Hopefully the peolple described on this site are not in that category, but if they are, then they should be dealt with accordingly with a mental health professional. It is also recommended that these patients live outside a family setting, especially where there are children..
I agree, personailty disorders can not be "fixed'. You can learn coping skills to deal with certian pd but that is it. However, I do think they can improve with DPT therapy and medication. The problem is with most of the elderly in our lives, they are not going to agree to therapy or medication or even be able to participate in it. My hardest part with dad right now, is as he ages , the OCD seems to be getting worse. For instance, there are napkins and paper towles all over the hosue all the time as he 1 never throws them away (I DO) and two he seems to have some obsession with them. Its disgusting. Yesterday my partner and I threw away a terrible disgusting box that dad had been suing to recycle pop cans. There are lots of empty boxes in the garage that he could have replaced that box with. Instead he went out to the garbage and got his box back. How unsanitary is that. And I wonder why we have a problem with ants. I am ready to be done with this and would be i f my fiancee was not jhere to support and encourage me. Dad drove him crazy this morning though, as he took Mikes' clothes our of the drying (not completly dry) and laid them on the kitchen table. At least its better then the last time when he just threw them in the garage in a pile in the corner.
Speaking as someone diagnosed with mental illness, Borderline Personality Disorder, depression, anxiety...I can say different disorders don't mix either and when I come across people either more severely effected than I am or with disorders that scare me, I am polite but keep my distance. It is much harder when it is family, (or yourself) but you are right. If you can avoid the person or limit your interaction it really does help. The world may be "crazy" but it is not all mentally ill and lots of people would just assume not be involved with those who are. That isn't really wrong. Would you want to be in a room with someone who had some icky, oozing disease if you didn't have to be. You can't "catch" crazy, but it can frustrate and limit your own life options severely as well as be quite uncomfortable to negotiate with in general.
J, I think that is part of the problem with dad and I amd Mike and dad. I am diagnoses bipolar with anxiety, and dealing with my own illness and working is a lot for me. In fact my DR. really doesnt like it when I workl more than part-time. On tope of that dealing with dads ocd is very difficult. Also Mike has an anxiety disorder and is just begining to learn abou it, so he has a very hard time with Dad. I am more well than I have been in a long time but it is a lot of work and doesnt leave much energy for unneccessary stress.
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She had you when she was 23 or 24 y/o, and was supposed to grow alongside with you. I guess there wasn't much of that, otherwise you wouldn't be so resentful after all these years. (Plus now you're having to sacrifice some of your life to take care of her.) Instead of the blissful childhood you hoped for, perhaps your mom resorted to regular doses of discipline to keep you on the straight and narrow. Still, had you come with instructions at birth, raising you would've been a lot easier.
It seems the roles are reversed now, but this is no time to contemplate payback no matter how stressed out you get. You do, however, need to find some closure. And you're not going to achieve this if you don't speak with her gently about these bottled up issues while keeping in mind she has a heart condition. Yes, you're having to forego a lot of things to take care of her and the resentment continues to fester within you. But remember that she tried to do the best she could with what she had. You're doing the same. She might not bring herself to admit it, but she's feeling guilty for not having been the mother you expected. At the same time, she feels grateful and lucky to have a daughter like you.
It's a tall order, but try to forget she's your mother for a moment and talk with her as if she were one of your girlfriends. Don't be crude, crass, obscene, and abusive. Channel all that resentment in a constructive manner and let the caring and nurturing woman that you are shine through. After all, your Mom must have done something right.
Be well my friend, and keep us posted. ... Inquiring minds want to know.
-- ED
Yeap, but some people think I'm overly simplistic when I point out how blinded people are by the darkness of F.O.G. Fear of breaking family, parental, mom's, even religious interpretations and applications of the Bible. Obligation to be driven to fulfill these obligations as if we are still emotionally that little girl or that little boy. Guilt from either out own over active super-ego (the parent in our head), from society who often does not know the whole story, from family/parents/mom, and sometimes very concrete religious minded people. As Admiral Perry said about the obstacles before him said "dam the torpedoes, full speed ahead" and he won.
You don't know how many meditation groups I attended then where a majority of the women were trying to over come being raped by their fathers when they were young...they were SURE of it...well they suspected it. Why else would they feel the way they felt about men and stuff. Then there was the backlash of the "false Memory" movement.
Regardless of how the movement got out of hand, I think some of those books and concepts would be helpful for us caregivers. Suggest "In the Family" by John Bradshaw (which was a wildly popular PBS TV series) and "Codependent No More" by Melodie Beattie. Once you get your hands on those books, there are others to handle more specific issues.
Stacey
You are very right that there are two different kinds of abuse.
I'm not sure how much more today's children are aware than we are more willing to face such things and talk about it as well as we have teachers and school administrators who are supposed to watch for evidence of this kind of thing.
My wife's mother should have been arrested long ago, but one problem was the isolation living in the county where such abuse is hidden easier.
Speaking of becoming aware of things in your 50's, what my mother covertly did to me as a child, and teenager is something that I've just had my eyes opened to within the last 3 years and it explains so much about my entire life.
AlzCaregiver ,
I deal with co-dependency myself and it flows like blood on this site!
Where do you think social workers find the most of this crap? Among sub-sections of the population who are big on control and particularly the control of everyone in a family. And it's worse in these country areas vs the city because it's like they have no concept of a healthy boundary even among relatives.
I get whacked daily by her stories and words. She has the power to blow off some of this old crusty junk we've all been carrying, with just a story or a few words. Warm enjoyable and refreshing ... and a lot of gals there guys! ;-)
I still think that healing can happen with a poem, story, movie. Not that the whole shebang is healed over, but one is standing facing a new direction. She is an artist at this...and she's worked with hospice hopsitals, etc. vets. you name it. quite a powerhouse.
Mental Illness is still the number one most prevalent problem in this country, and probably the world, I don't know.. Abuse, Bullying, Rampant so-called "Discipline", and Nasty Criticism are all forms of mental illness.
We don't label it as such, but that is what it is. The problem is how to deal with it. Each of us has our own way of dealing with mentally ill people. I think that the best way to deal with it is to dimiss yourself from the source. It may seem cruel, but you have to save yourself. If it were a serious communicable disease, contagious and spreading, would you stick around? No, of course not. So, why not dismiss yourself from the source (s) of mental illness......mentally ill people?
I could say more about child and spouse abuse, but I must bite my tongue on that one or I will EXPLODE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
So I try to reason with her and assure her I would never do anything to hurt her or trespass in her things. Now, how I mentally get over this heart breaking attacks from her ..... is to pray and give it up to God. I know you may think that's baloney, but it works. As I have been ready to pack my things and never see her again forever, I would only hurt my father and she still wouldn't understand. But GOD has pulled me through, pulled me UP, and now when she attacks, I'm cool, It's cool, and I forgive her, give it up to God to deal with and totally let it go.
I have a five year old that I adopted from birth, and believe me my hearts ripped out when she attacks anything about my baby. And again immediate prayer and surrender and forgiveness heals the wound and allows me to once again show her my love through Christ.
God Bless you and I'll hold you in my prayers.
I sure hope that your 5 year old is not having to grow up around your mom because she doesn't sound like a healthy person to be around.
All mental illness are NOT personality disorders. The conditions that rank as P.D. are extremely serious, as you know, and require special skillls to treat. Some P.D.'s can never be "cured", just dealt with.
If you know, or are living with someone who has been diagnosed with a P.D. , it is best that you do not try to solve their problems, or even take them on. Hopefully the peolple described on this site are not in that category, but if they are, then they should be dealt with accordingly with a mental health professional. It is also recommended that these patients live outside a family setting, especially where there are children..
However, I do think they can improve with DPT therapy and medication. The problem is with most of the elderly in our lives, they are not going to agree to therapy or medication or even be able to participate in it.
My hardest part with dad right now, is as he ages , the OCD seems to be getting worse.
For instance, there are napkins and paper towles all over the hosue all the time as he 1 never throws them away (I DO) and two he seems to have some obsession with them. Its disgusting.
Yesterday my partner and I threw away a terrible disgusting box that dad had been suing to recycle pop cans. There are lots of empty boxes in the garage that he could have replaced that box with. Instead he went out to the garbage and got his box back. How unsanitary is that. And I wonder why we have a problem with ants.
I am ready to be done with this and would be i f my fiancee was not jhere to support and encourage me. Dad drove him crazy this morning though, as he took Mikes' clothes our of the drying (not completly dry) and laid them on the kitchen table. At least its better then the last time when he just threw them in the garage in a pile in the corner.
Also Mike has an anxiety disorder and is just begining to learn abou it, so he has a very hard time with Dad. I am more well than I have been in a long time but it is a lot of work and doesnt leave much energy for unneccessary stress.