When is enough enough with narcissistic parents?

So Gia, it's 6 months later and I wonder, did you bring your aunt to live near you? If so, how is that going? There are some clues in your posting that I saw in my relationship with my mom that I would have warned you about if I'd seen this sooner. Oh, well..... I would like to know if you're doing well with her.

Boundaries: either set some, or give up! There's no in-between when it comes to dealing with a narcicist!

It's up to you when enough is enough. But it can be hard to know your own feelings and boundaries after a lifetime of abuse.

My mother is a narcissist and dad and sister sociopaths. Brother is head injured and alcoholic along with dad and sister. I'm the only "normal" member of my family though not perfect.

Growing up in this mess was very damaging. I was miserable growing up and then moved far away when I was 17. I became completely estranged at 45 and returned at 60, a year ago. Things were quiet for 6 months but recently fell apart, not to my surprise.

Every time I see my mother I feel horrible for a week afterward. With her it's "my way or the highway". She has never admitted to or apologized for her lifelong abuse of me; I've never seen her apologize to anyone for anything. She is mean, selfish and cruel but plays the sweetheart around friends and family.

She has split our family apart with "divide and conquer" tactics--no one is friends with anyone else. She is jealous of me and has used many methods to exclude me from my own family. She's worth a little money now and leaves her will lying around face up where everyone will see it and know they better suck up to her.

I'm now living 3 miles away and she has cut me out again. After years of attempts to "fix" things I can only conclude that a total cut off is the best thing for me. (I even tried to fix things despite several psychologists advising me to run. Duh.)

It's fine if you decide not to waste any more time or energy on people who hurt you over and over again.

I am dealing with four advanced-age adults who are all in varying degrees of dementia or cognitive decline/poor decision-making, and all of whom have a lengthy history of substance abuse of one kind or another as well as all being varying flavors of narcissistic egotists. Two of them are my parents, the other two are their spouse-oids (one a 3rd husband of my mother, the other the long-time girlfriend of my father.) I've been in recovery for 30 years myself, and have also gotten help with my history of codependency due to growing up with a couple of self-centered, angry, controlling alcoholics. The bottom line is that I find myself completely embroiled and confused and miserable when I am around these deeply dysfunctional people and I honestly want very little to do with them. I am infinitely more content and calm the less I have to do with them. They are all crazy-makers, unable to tell the truth unless it serves them, manipulative, cagey, materialistic and self-serving. As far as my parents are concerned, I feel that I have an obligation to 'help' them as best I can, but I do not want to participate in their craziness. My mother is so far gone into her Alzheimers (after years of being particularly nasty to me and my children, her grandchildren) that she is the least of it now. She can no longer drink because she's forgotten she wants it, which is an improvement. She fell and broke her hip, drunk, a few years ago, which accelerated her dementia decline. Her husband was running a nightly 'party' in their 80's - lots of wine for her and, cannabis and some wine for him. She married this freeloading 3rd husband who is a long-term pothead and arrogant narcissist, and who she defers to, and whose personality is now changing and filter going - he is becoming nastier and nastier himself, especially to me, who he views as 'competition' or fears because I have legal control over my mother's affairs. I try to minimize contact with him, give him a long financial leash, for the moment, and not cross him as best I can, and give my mother lots of hugs when I do see her, since I don't think she will be around that long, or even if she lasts awhile, she may get to the point where she no longer knows me. If she could see herself now she would be so appalled. The 3rd husband weaseled in and married her when she was already beginning to be demented, in order to get on the dole and be supported. My irrational father has had two strokes and is now drinking again, with his medication, which his M.D. said he should not, and recently overflowed a toilet in his house and will not listen to me when I try to talk to him about hiring a sewage cleanup company for the mess. (I'm working on that!) He also lives like a slob/hoarder and thinks his house is normal. He is stubborn and irrational, and does not particularly want to discuss solutions, but prefers to change the subject to his girlfriend who will not get out of bed due to her depression, pill abuse and alcoholism. He believes she is the main problem, of course, and cannot look at himself. I have acceptance of my parent's dementia/cognitive decline, but less for the fact that their behavior is a continuation of a lifetime run on self-will and the belief they are superior to others. I cannot help feeling that all these people bear responsibility for the self-destructive choices they have made in their lives and continue to make, for their arrogant and dishonest ways of dealing with themselves and others and their continuing substance abuse. To try to solve these people's problems when they do not want them solved, is a fool's errand. Still, I feel some obligation to try to help my parents not to end up in abjectly awful circumstances. I do not feel much obligation toward the dysfunctional spouse-oids, though I did have to call 911 the last time the girlfriend attempted suicide by pills. If this all sounds completely nuts, well, yes, it is. Friends have told me there's a screenplay in it, but I don't think it would be entertaining! I am hoping to make some progress on getting my father's house cleaned up and hiring a cleaner to keep it up somewhat if he can be convinced in some way to allow this. Of course my father resists any functional plans, in general. My husband reminds me often that a huge part of the problem in trying to help them is they do not want help. I would say they do not want any constructive help, they just want to continue their unhealthy lifestyles and try to juice me for service, service toward further irrationality. Every time I spend much time around them I am drained afterwards and it can take me days to get centered again. Much as I love my parents, I cannot take their consequences for them. They are apparently going to have to decline and die as they have lived, in denial, anger and blame of others. When I read caregiver forums I see so many people, usually women, but some men, just completely burnt out. I feel I have given so much of my lifeblood, if you will, to my crazy parents in this lifetime, that I am just not willing to engage much more at this point. I have spent an immense amount of energy redirecting my life toward a more positive lifestyle, I don't want to be embroiled in the 'old ways' or be around it. Of course it pushes my buttons and when around them I can lapse back into normalizing their behavior even while I know it is sick - it's just so overwhelming to be around it. When I try to accomplish anything constructive with them, there is so much resistance I can feel my blood pressure go up due to frustration at the stubborn self-destructive insanity. I realized then I must back away, leave them to their consequences and 'let go and let God' as the say in 12 step, or I will end up being the one with a stroke. I refuse to let them kill me. I love them, but I owe myself better than their lifestyle and values. I need to take care of myself first. I have young adult children, and sometimes I fear becoming as crazy as my parents and inflicting myself on them in the same way in my old age, but I have made different choices in my life than my parents, gotten sober, go to meditation weekly and practice recovery, so I can only hope. Interestingly, while I was deeply depressed and self-destructive at the ages my children are now, my own young adult children are overall, cheerful, competent and functional, so I like to think my recovery was operative in providing a much less unhealthy upbringing for them - not perfect, but not horribly dysfunctional. Again, I don't judge my parents for their dementia, which is not their fault, but I do need to remember their sick personalities and anti-spiritualism pre-date their mental condition, and that's what I need to be cautious around. There's no real solution it seems, just trying to cultivate calm and detachment from the insanity is my goal. It's hard to maintain new behaviors and not relapse into old patterns with them and not be enmeshed, but it's worth the continuous effort to try, repeatedly.

the middleseat--

Wow, what a story; I believe you. My family is nuts too, but I don't love them anymore. I feel badly for my brother and nephews but I'm sick of my parents and sister and the way I keep trying to fix things even though it has never worked. I should know better.

You sound very sane. Your kids turned out well and there are no typos in your message, a rarity these days!

Take great care of yourself!

Middleseat - well put!

“I don't judge my parents for their dementia, which is not their fault, but I do need to remember their sick personalities and anti-spiritualism pre-date their mental condition, and that's what I need to be cautious around. There's no real solution it seems, just trying to cultivate calm and detachment from the insanity is my goal.”

My dad is a narcissist and has been a PITA to me all my life, and now is doing it to the nursing staff in the SNF. I do love him and as he declines he gets nicer (to me, at least). He has literally made his own bed because he will not help himself with his ADLs - he'd rather yell at the CNAs. A new thing today is that he was still in bed in PJs at 2 pm when I went to visit. He's apparently been fighting the staff who are trying to get him out of bed and dressed in the morning. He said he'd get dressed but when the CNAs got there, he changed his mind and kept rolling back into the bed. SO....they covered him up, and I said loudly "OK, well, if you are not well enough to be dressed at 2 in the afternoon, I guess I'd better leave and let you get some rest." He huffed and puffed a little, but was rather quiet. I think I will take that course of action from now on. It's so hard to tell if they are actually needing help and care, or if they are milking it. Today he was definitely milking it. Best of luck - stay strong. :) Feel free to PM me is you like.

Have parent have a psych evaluation. My mother has been bipolar all my life but her medication calms her down. Back away as you will never call their bluff. It's a mental disease which you cannot win but you can tame. I sometimes feel it was their era to just be narcissistic. When my mother begins with an "I don't believe you" I tell her I am not going to watch a movie with you and be talked to in a mean manner and I leave the room. After a while, she will ask me to come back and I ask her is she going to be nice. Then she will complain about the commercials and I explain its free tv so someone pays for the movie which is the commercials. It soooo takes thick skin and only you know if you have it or if you have the wherewithal to grow it. Best of Luck

LOL BlueRidge!!!! This is now my backup plan too! I think I should post this somewhere!!! Knowing this is an option ie put her in the hands of APS and walk has given me the core of strength I need. There is so much good advice and empathy here. I don't remember who said it but this site and the amazing people on it has given me so much strength and comfort. Bless you all!

"There's no real solution it seems, just trying to cultivate calm and detachment from the insanity is my goal. It's hard to maintain new behaviors and not relapse into old patterns with them and not be enmeshed, but it's worth the continuous effort to try, repeatedly."

Well said --themiddleseat! Thank you for sharing that wisdom.

My mother & sister are VERY NARCISSISTIC. They team up & make up sum off the wall stuff. Oh boy... Most days I'm in the TWILIGHT ZONE... I don't want nothing to do with any of them. It's hard....

Sometimes, distance is the best and only answer... and, there’s nothing wrong with that to keep one’s sanity, peace and quality of life.💕

This is a hard one as it is also the same situation I am in. I get blamed & treated like dirt. My so called mother & sister team up against me. It's sickening. I'm learning to control how I react to it. If anybody has any suggestions on how to be in a family like this or how to deal with a mother that's this way...please leave some reply

I'm doing telephone support groups through Ala non, Adult Children of Alcoholics,
and Overeaters Anonymous. Even if there isn't an active alcoholic currently in your
family, the destructive behavior and chaos of a narcissistic family member(s) is quite
similar to that of an alcoholic. And it really helps to have some support when you're too tired to even leave the house and you're beginning to doubt your own sanity.

Also, I used to drink to deal with the stress of dealing with the perpetual chaos caused
by the narcissists on my life. I switched to comfort eating and I'm finding that certain foods will really trigger depression. And It's pretty entrenched for me to reach for food when I'm stressed now. OA support groups have definitely started to help.

The ONLY good thing about late stage Alzheimer's is that the narcissism goes away, leaving a shell (body) of the person who used to be so self centered. Now they are so out of it mentally that there are no thoughts at all. It's a blessing and a tragedy at the same time. :(

@SueC1957 . That is a sad kind of mixed blessing :(

I had a full blown argument with my mother 2 days ago..which...surprise surprise..she started. I'm sitting in my room (I live with her..im her pca worker). I can't get myself to talk to her or look at her. She doesn't either to me as well. I'm realizing at 43 how much I've emotionally been damaged by her behaviors. When I was 8 I had to take care of my siblings while she was in a mental institution all my childhood years. I was gone the last 5 years. And I can't believe I NVR realized who she really was. I'm currently trying to find my own place. I am a RNA. I have a good job & friends that are there 4 me. My sister is a clone of my mom. This is so hard to deal with when u live in the same household. Once I leave I wash my hands from these people. I was in a car accident 14 years ago...i lost my 4 yr old daughter...Time to call it ...Done.

hayley, I'm so sorry for your loss of your daughter. The most painful thing anyone
can experience. And you're living in a toxic environment now and how can you heal?

My mom should have been institutionalized, actually she was frequent topic of
convo with neighbors who wanted her placed because she was so combative
even with them. I was her care giver and everyday was hell with her. This kind
of experience can cause PTSD and its tough to get over,

You need to heal and live your life in a loving peaceful environment.
You've already done your time. You're luckier than most you've got a good job
and friends. Don't.lose.them. Go! Heal yourself and enjoy your life. Your mom
doesn't want to enjoy hers and likewise wants to prevent you from enjoying yours.
Get her set up and get the hell out. They will sap all the joy out of
your life. Don't let them!!!!!!! It wont help them anyways ,and it sure as hell wont help
you!! Good luck and (((hugs)))) .

Thank You Bettina!!! Your so kind....hugs to you ❤🌷

I'm with Bettina Haley... Get out if you can... when you can... 'They have no conscience ... It's those that care like you that suffer because you 'feel' (I'm also realizing this after decades of beating my head against a wall)... Nothing phases them... You've lost your daughter... That's enough for you to endure. Please know that you're a wonderful person... and, that you deserve a Beautiful life... without them (they don't deserve you)... 'We' must learn to not play into this toxic and dangerous game of the sick.

I agree !!! I just keep hoping I find anywhere to live soon...these people are driving me insane

[ Heart2Heart wrote:
28 days ago
I'm with Bettina Haley... Get out if you can... when you can... 'They have no conscience ... It's those that care like you that suffer because you 'feel' (I'm also realizing this after decades of beating my head against a wall)... Nothing phases them... You've lost your daughter... That's enough for you to endure. Please know that you're a wonderful person... and, that you deserve a Beautiful life... without them (they don't deserve you)... 'We' must learn to not play into this toxic and dangerous game of the sick. ]





Heart2heart:



I agree with you 100 percent.



I think too many people try to rationalize the behavior of malignant narcissists. They try to use logic to explain to them when they make hurtful comments.  They likely do this hoping it will bring about a change of heart in an NPD.


This however is simply feeding the narcissist. They take pleasure in knowing how and why they hurt you. They will not use it to educate themselves on how to treat you better.



So telling them exactly what they said or did to hurt you or even acknowledging that they hurt you simply feeds their need for narcissistic supply.

There is a book called:

"People of the Lie: The Hope for Healing Human Evil" By M. Scott Peck ...

Peck is now dead and at the time he wrote the book he received a lot of flack from the medical profession because he labeled people with NPD as being truly evil.

Perhaps he was right. They are just evil, no matter the root cause.

When dealing with a malignant narcissist or NPD the best thing to do is to remove yourself from their lives, before they inflict so much damage that you become just like them.

I know that this is too late, but I want to answer. I have a narcisstic parent (mother). Well, she were like this even when I was just a small child around the age of 4. Well, no need for the story since it is obvious, I'm only here to answer. The thing is that, I just knew that it was too much when I was 14 she had already convinced me that I was not good enough and that she was always right (mothers knows best). I became anorexic at the age of 12 and stopped at 14. I just bottled all my thoughts and then let it go when she decides to boast again about her work. Well, actually, ever since that happened, I started living with my grandmother, but sometimes, she comes home (and we fight) too. So basically, I combined all my thoughts, all my experiences and feelings with her into arguments. Don't let them control you. Maybe pretend (like I did) then leave them whrn you get abused. Easy.

Today i was officially fired from my mom . I no longer take care of her. And of course my replacements are her narcissistic daughter...my so called sister & my nephew.. these 3 ARE ALL SICK. And my mom has Been making me give her half of my checks.NOT ANYMORE. I GET paid weekly. So I'm gonna make sure she signs next week's papers cause I'm NOT GIVING HER A DIME. What kind of mother does this? A psycho..any input...? I could sure use some

Good for you standing up for yourself. It will get easier with time and you will come to respect yourself for having a backbone. Bad idea to ever "play" in the same sandbox with a narcissist.

Oh yeah...next week will be my last check...

I'm glad I'm done ...i really am.

I'm glad you're glad, hayley; it may be scary at first, but it WILL be better! If they call and try to hook you back in, please do not fall for it; it will be worse than it already has been the next time. God bless and have a good time now!

Thank You ❤

Hayley - you are doing the right thing by getting away. Look after yourself - build up the life you want. As mally says, don't get hooked back in; Look out for the FOG - fear, obligation and guilt. They will try to use that to manipulate you. They are sick.

Concentrate on staying healthy yourself. Reduce contact as much as you need to. I have found narcissists use money as part of their control. Get your self detached and emotionally distanced. There is good info online about narc mothers.

((((((hugs))))))