How can I fake grieving when I have no grief?

My husband visited the hospital again last night and asked to talk to a nurse. He was there at the change in schedules at 7:00 pm and nobody could tell him anything. He ended up politely letting the hospital and nurses know what he thought of them for the care that has and has not been given to his mother. They either couldn't tell him or didn't know who could tell him or wouldn't tell him anything. They don't know who her doctor now is. It is written in her records who her doctor is, but he has washed his hands of her because an ER doctor admitted her. A hospitalist is ordering minimal care, but he knows nothing about her health.

This morning she did eat breakfast without throwing up and my husband thinks she will come home but he isn't certain. I have no idea what is going on and I hate all this uncertainty. Since I am only a "family member" and do not have POA, I can do nothing.

He asked them about the "kidney stone", loss of blood" ,"continued nausea", and no-one had an answer for him. He asked them what tests had been performed. They said "None".

I never said that I also babysit one to three grandchildren 8,9, and 10, while I "caregive" MIL, did I? Yep, I do that, too. What we do for our kids, huh. At least they can partially take care of themselves and get to the potty alone.

All I can say, funnier, is that this is one huge mystery. And a hospital that is full of bunglers, at that. Is it just me, or where I live, or is it very irregular to keep a patient in the hospital without much care or testing? Is it a matter of which doc does or doesn't want the responsibility of releasing her, finding out she shouldn't have been released and then getting into hot water for doing so? They wanted to throw my dying father out of the hospital back in 1995 unless we agreed to letting them do some sort of testing, more bloodwork, etc. and I told them "please, let this poor man die in peace...he has been poked and prodded quite enough" and sure enough, he died the next day. (My mother just didn't want him to die at home and have to "deal" with such a thing.) But hospitals never want a bed to go to waste, so is this a bit erratic for them to just keep her and no one knowing or relaying anything to the family? Whose patient IS she? Someone out there must have some advice as to whose 'head' Funnier's husband can go over to get some answers in the hospital administration ranks?

I felt like they were just going to let her die, but I know they don't want a death in their hospital. As far as I know, the Hospitalist is the only one seeing her. This doctor does have the capability to release her. I spoke to the Home Health nurse yesterday and asked her to speak to the charge nurse on that floor and get the PIN number for me. She said she would and will give it to me so I can talk to the nurse and get some kind of information. It may be very little, but it may be something. It's 11:30 AM right now and she hasn't called me, but she also works in Intensive Care there and may not have had time to get the PIN number yet. I don't want MIL to die at home, either. I've told my husband to change her doctor to his and he said he will if she will let him. I told him he has her POA, JUST DO IT! He says "Not without her permission" Her own doctor has already said he is not treating her now. What more reason could she have for changing. He just has to convince her. If not, she is doomed to have no doctor at all.

Ok...who can speak to your husband to get him to be reasonable? It's very honorable and noble to get her permission, yes...but has he had the realization yet that she might not be in sound enough mind to make good health care decisions? Right now, he is not acting in her best interest and if one of your children might be able to have a little chat with him, it might help. He may be looking at you as someone who is simply tired of taking care of his mother. Her "own doctor" sound like he should be brought up on some kind of charges! By the way, did he say why he washed his hands of her?? (I have had it happen with my own mother--they get to the point where the patient doesn't allow them to do their job. There is more to this story with your MIL than is meeting the eye.)

PS I certainly don't want to influence you here, but do you want her coming home without a GP in place?

your husband, pardon my language, is completely pussy whipped by his mother! and apparently she tried the same thing on her doctor and he refused to put up with it. screw the whole permission thing, your husband has POA, it's time for him to step up and make a decision. is he a little boy or is he a man? i left a little boy because i was tired of being his mommy.

btw, it is completely impossible to get any information from anyone at a hospital during a shift change. they weren't being rude, it's just impossible to help you during that time. nurses have a very limited amount of time to exchange a LOT of information about each and every single patient on the ward with each and every nurse there, as well as the ward clerk, and sometimes the doctor on call. when i have been a patient, we were not allowed to ask for or get medications or drinks of water during that time, and god forbid anyone have to go to the bathroom if they needed help. you learn to work around the nurses and hospital schedule.

sound wrong? imagine if somebody gave you six or eight of your MiL to care for, at the end of an eight or twelve hour shift when you are exhausted, you had about 15 to 30 minutes to tell the next nurse(s) EVERYTHING about EVERY PATIENT. what meds, when, what food, how much, and when, what liquids, how much, when, urine, bowl movements, output and when, their mood, their visitors, and on and on.

choose a quieter time of day or evening to speak with the nurses. if you can't get any answers, then you need to ask for a patient advocate.

PamelaSue... I just love the straight shooting style of yours!
I agree, Funnier, I think your husband needs to grab the reins here, but I'm sure he's having some inner struggle with this. My heart goes to you though, and not him. You've been the one doing the work, and it sounds like it hasn't been one bit easy. Its been 24 hours as of now, since you last posted. What's the latest? You get to talk to a nurse, or am I way behind and mil is home now?

PamelaSue, a good book about such Mom Enmeshed Men is When He's Married to Mom: How to Help Mother-Enmeshed Men Open Their Hearts to True Love and Commitment by Kenneth Adams.

Thank you Judy and cmagnum! Fortunately I was able to teach my husband that "I" came first. However he transferred his dependence to me and that became unbearable when coupled with his addictive personality, (drugs or alcohol, whatever's available for him). So I cut myself loose when the last child reached adulthood. I won't divorce him only because he would lose the medical benefits that my being a veteran provides for him and he has a few bad health problems, but I have my own house and I am about as free as I can be. (I took the truck, so I grocery shop for him once a week)

Yep, I'm a straight shooter! I developed the style when I was a mother and it's only sharpened over the years. I do have to watch myself that it's not overtly, or even covertly cruel, I can get carried away. But sometimes things just need to be said, wake up calls are in order. Often people know these things in the back of their minds anyway.

Everyone in his family thought my husband was the sweetest thing on the face of the earth. The people in this county tell me what a wonderful man he is. They don't know the same man I do. He can be the man they tell me he is, but he can also be a dictator like he is being now about his Mother. He will absolutely not place his Mother any place other than in the bedroom across from ours, even if it was free. She came home last evening during a terrible storm and I couldn't believe the EMT's actually rolled her up the sidewalk in the rain! They had a sheet over her face but she still got wet. Another storm happened during the night and awakened her and she called for me and "potty duty". Just like old times again. She got sick during the day today and doesn't want supper now. The doctors who treated her have unpronouncable names didn't find out what causes that--one of the primary reasons she went there.

My helper told me today the doctor told her "they didn't get it all" when they removed more mammary tissue last week and are talking about a mastectomy now. If she needs that done, she will be disabled for awhile and I won't have any help at all while she is gone. I know others have been sole caregivers before, but I don't look forward to it. I had surgery in my future also and it will be canceled now.
You say, "find someone to come stay with her while you are gone". That's all well and good. But, she wants no-one but ME taking her to the potty. I suppose if I was gone and a stranger was here and she needed to go, she wouldn't have a choice, though.

The home health nurse told him recently that it was unbelievable how wonderful she is doing and it is only because of the care she is getting at home. I wish she hadn't done that.

Don't cancel your surgery. Please. You mil will HAVE to let someone else help her for the bathroom. I know insurance is getting pretty strict about hospital stays, but it'd be great if you could tack an extra night or two onto your stay. Isn't it sad when surgery is a break to look forward to? Does your helper have anyone that can fill in for her? My friend does caregiving for an elderly lady, and when she can't make it, her oldest daughter fills in. Just a thought. My nephew has been a godsend for me lately. I feel for you, Funnier. It sounds like you're in such a hard spot. I sound awful, but I was hoping it was her time to go when she was admitted. She can't be having a great life in her condition, and she's draining the enjoyment out of yours.

Umm, excuse me funnier, but do you have a life? Do you want one? You are considering putting off your own surgery so that MIL won't have to cope with a stranger taking her potty. ARE YOU CRAZY?!

It sounds like the people in your house who are important are #1 MIL, #2 Husband and then waaaaay down the list, little ol' you. Why do you put up with that crap? Seriously, why are you allowing this to continue in the same old pattern?

You are right, jeanne, I don't think I have a life. Or a say-so in my life. I don't know how to stop this without hurting myself. I have epilepsy and I don't drive and my Social Security check won't support me if I'm by myself. I think this opens up a can of worms, though. Right now, he's my ride so I just have to do what he wants. She can't live forever, can she?

Quote : "But, she wants no-one but ME taking her to the potty. I suppose if I was gone and a stranger was here and she needed to go, she wouldn't have a choice, though."
That's right, funnier. You are letting her rule. It takes two. My mother would like me to do everything for her too, but, guess what? I don't. Does she get mad? Yes.
Or at least she did. She has accepted the situation better now. Does she bad mouth me to relatives, and particularly my sister. You bet. Do I care? No! Did I have to cut way back on what I did for her to look after my health? Yes, I did. The end result of this is that other people do the necessary care giving, I am getting my health back, she accepts the situation better, though complains about the care she gets all the time. Now I visit her in her ALF, take her out for a meal once in a while, and answer one in 10 or 20 emails, when I feel like it. She is no unhappier than she ever has been, and is as well looked after as she can be.
Please do NOT put off sny surgery you need, because that prima donna wants you to take her to the potty. There was a phrase "Suck it up, Princess" which applies here. Look after yourself, and let her ( and your husband) suck it up. You have gone over and above your duty to her - look after your duty to yourself. See your doctor, schedule the surgery, make whatever arangements you need to for your mil's care, then tell your husband that it is happening.
NO our mil can't live forever, and neither can you or your husband. (((((((hugs)))))))

Hi again, Funnier...well, I guess the 'roll' is started now, i.e., you are supposed to come first (your vows, remember the part about forsaking all others). Hate to say it, but your husband is not putting you first. I know it's difficult but it's time to say "UNCLE" and tell your husband if he's so crazy about having her home and not in a facility, he is simply going to have to hire someone to come in. I don't CARE what it is "she wants" because just like my own mother, there was absolute selfishness on her part and getting her own needs met was priority #1. Whether it killed you or not, she never noticed. She managed to put my father in the grave, but my brother and I decided we were finished with it. Your MIL sounds just like her. I agree with the other poster who said she probably ticked off too many people in the hospital, and they just wanted her out. Same thing with my mother, she drove everyone nuts. Tell your hubby it's time to fish or cut bait.

Hey, Funnier...start the ball rolling. Go to the website care.com and find someone who NEEDS A JOB BADLY to come in and give you a break. You need surgery and you aren't getting it? This is where I am very angry with your husband. Please, believe me, we aren't trying to start WWIII here, but trying to get you to stop being Mrs. Nicey-Nice and realize this thankless task is taking away your life, your liberty and your health.

all of us here are in agreement, you need to put your foot down and quit letting both of them treat you like sh!t. for truly, YOU are the one letting them do so. quit making excuses! quit playing martyr.

it's time to tell your husband to make a choice; is he married to you, or is he married to mommy? if you leave him, you do get some of his money, so don't let that stop you. 49 years of marriage is probably going to get you some alimony. also, when you do leave him, he has no way to take care of mommy by himself anyway. has HE ever taken her to the bathroom? and mommy ain't gonna to be too happy with that either. nursing home will look really good right about the time he has to help her drop trow.

schedule your surgery for crimeny's sake! to not do so is just plain suicide.

btw funnier, my epilepsy and fears kept me from driving for years; i didn't get my license until i was forty years old. it never kept me from having a life though. i took the bus everywhere with my four kids, and i mean EVERYWHERE. beaches, waterparks, the San Diego Zoo, Balboa Park and all the museums, the Children's museum in downtown San Diego, Malls all over the place, my sister across town by two buses and the trolley. sometimes a trip might take 2, or 3 buses, and take up to 3 hours, but we went places and had fun. their friends were jealous and sometimes asked to go with us. i even took two of my sons on a camping trip by bus once! my jobs were by bus and by bicycle. i had to pull the kid's wagon 1.5 miles away to do my grocery shopping, load a weeks worth of groceries into it, (for a family of six), and haul it back home. I did this late at night so that the food wouldn't spoil in the heat of the day. i did all of our doctor and dental appointments by bus.

because i had been on medication and seizure free for quite a while, my oldest son's father and his wife knew it was more about my fear, so they gave me a car that they were going to trade in, and encouraged me to relearn driving. God Bless them. Nervous as hell, but with my husband's and my oldest son's help I learned. Failed the first test, got drunk and cried. Dried my tears, called back that afternoon, rescheduled the test for five days later. Passed.
: )

But the real truth is, I never stopped living even when I didn't have that license. I'm telling you the same thing I tell teenagers who tell me that they can't do anything or go anywhere without a license, BULL. I worked as a teen without a license, and I worked as an adult without one. I lived on my own without a vehicle when I got out of the military and held a job then too.

no excuses.

Funnier...I'm not even Jewish but reading the post above I am compelled to say "OY VEY." You hadn't mentioned you also raised 4 children before now, had epilepsy, got it under control, got your fear of driving under control and were a wonderful mother to your children..and now this with the MIL? You are going to have to re-read all these posts demanding things of you to do, which I know you are reading, shaking your head and saying "easier said than done" but you know what? God led you to this board and it may be His way of saying you need to open your eyes, stop being the martyr and maid and caretaker to the world and start salvaging the life He gave you. You are more deserving than this life and your husband needs to also tell Mommy that hey, thrilled you lived this long, but we need to start enjoying our own golden years. How did that generation come to be so selfish? As I said, had this with my own mother who sucked the life out of everyone but let me tell you, when she was in her 50s she forced my father to retire so they could enjoy life! They never were home a weekend, were snowbirds in Florida during the winter, and didn't give a crap about anything but her own enjoyment. You reap what you sow. You sowed much better than you are reaping. Time's up. Time for #1.

MIL is asleep and I've re-read the last 20 or so comments on this thread. You all are right. I am an enabler, I believe.

I had complained to my doctor about this situation a year ago and the stress I am under from taking care of MIL and from being afraid to even bring the subject up to my husband of placing her in a nursing home. He asked me "Why are you so afraid of him"? I guess it's because his words are as sharp as a knife. I think I used to be afraid of MIL because I thought she had some control over him, but I can tell it's he who has the control. I've turned control over to him at the beginning of our marriage, I'm afraid, and it would be WW111 if I try to get any of it back. I guess if I'm not willing to take the steps I know I should take, steps you have all suggested I should take, then I have no right to complain. Once when we actually discussed the D word, he said he would just stop making payments on this house. He said knew I couldn't pay for it and I would lose it. He can be the sweetest, kindest man on earth and get angry and be totally the opposite. I understand women who keep returning to men who physically abuse them. I am staying with one who has verbally and emotionally abused me. "Dumping" his Mother on me is just another thing he has done to confirm it. I'm free and she is safe here.

I'll probably keep my feelings to myself around him and just come here and cry and you can read my comments and ignore me.

"I guess if I'm not willing to take the steps I know I should take, steps you have all suggested I should take, then I have no right to complain."

You come here to complain and to vent. That is perfectly all right. But please, please, state right in each new thread that you are here to vent, that you know what you would need to do to change your situation, and you are not willing to do it. Then we can offer you sympathy and pats on the back, but we will not waste our energy telling you what you already know and do not want to hear.

Judy, i think you are mixing me up with Funnier.

Funnier, get a lawyer and find out what your options are re: divorce. You have let your husband tell you that you will be screwed, I really doubt that you will be. Often they can force the sale of a house with proceeds split evenly so that something like that does not happen.

Something you should do right now, follow the money, make sure he doesn't have any squirreled away anywhere in accounts that you have no access to. If he does, make note of them for your lawyer. Make a full accounting of all of his assets, etc. Do all of this without him knowing!

The "prime" question on this Forum is: "Caregiver, how are you doing today?"
Funnierthanme is going thru a tough time. The responses showing lack of compassion with brutally , hurtful replies are monuments to poor taste and demonstrate a complete lack of understanding of "caregiver burnout"

Funnier, we would never ignore you! You are in a situation and you need help. Isn't it amazing your husband would challenge you in this way, saying he won't pay the mortgage if you leave. I guess he is happy being simply a meal ticket instead of a husband and that is your payment for being cook, housekeeper and caregiver. Others on this board may have some suggestions for you. I wish I did, as I would love to see you happier. Shame on him for keeping you trapped this way, I'm so sorry. Come here any time--we are more than willing to listen and support you, as best we can here on a website. Hugs and love.

Marty - There is some truth in what you say; however, there is compassion and caring and truth in most of what the others say too. Their comments, though some may appear harsh, are said in love - tough love perhaps - but definitely out of carnng for funnier, and the very difficult situuation she is in. Some of us believe that funnier can change her situation for the better, and are urging her so to do. We are suggesting that she explore her options, we are sharing the experiences we have had that have improved our lives, We do this out of concern for her. Now she has made it clear, which she had not at the beginning, (and perhaps she didn't know her own position then), that she has no intention of making any changes. On other threads here people have taken suggestions to heart, made changes and improved their circumstances. The suggestions on other threads were not worded any more softly than the ones here. Don't think for a minute that most of us (I can't speak for all, as I don't know you all, but I know enough about many from following threads) do not understand caregiver burnout. It is exactly because we understand it that we speak as we do. I have been burned out, with declining health, and feeling like I had no options too. But, I found I did have options, I followed them and everyone is as well off or better off now. It isn't necessarily easy, but it is possible.
freespirit - it is a very tough job. being there for someone from time to time is very different from being there hour, after hour, after hour. As we age, and still have to look after our parents, their needs/problems increase, and our resources decrease. It is not a parallel to looking after children when you are young, in my view and the views of many others here. To expect someone - or for someone to expect it of themselves - to give up their own health concerns to look after a senior, is, in my mind self destructive. I can agree that seeing that the senior is well cared for, is an obligation, but not that family, or family in law in this case, has the obligation to do it themselves, especially when it is tearing down their physical and emotional health. There is a risk to caregiving,

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2008 Rocky Mountain Geriatrics Conference in Salt Lake City, Utah, Richard Schulz, Ph.D. from the University of Pittsburgh School of Medicine
- a heavy caregiver -- meaning that the caregiver must start helping the care recipient with activities of daily living (ADLs) -- is associated with the higher rates of depression, poorer health, poorer self-care habits, unintended weight loss, and increased chronic illness...•Increased caregiver strain, such as advancing from "light" caregiving duties to "heavy" ones, tends to increase caregiver mortality. In other words, caregivers who have heavier caregiving duties are more likely to die from any cause than caregivers with lighter duties.
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And we are cautioned not to take this lightly, and I don't.

punchnjudy - good for you - I wish funnier was in a better situation too, However, i can't completely fault her husband, here, though I, too, find his behaviour shameful. It takes two.
funnier, you have made your choices, to the best of your ability for now. I respect that. BTDT. My hope, and prayer for you, is that you move to a place in your mind, your heart, your life where you care more about you than you do right now. You are worth it, dear one. You are a caring, woman, a special person, please care for the treasure that is within you.
Love and hugs
Joan

freespirit44, please no guilt trips. no one here needs or wants them.

my mother was an emotionally and sometimes physically abusive mother and still is. she is lucky that i do anything for her.

because of her i decided to be the kind of mother i wished i had had, one who was actually a part of her children's lives. i never could spoil them with things, i spoiled them with my love and time.

this does NOT mean that i expect my children to sacrifice EVERYTHING for me! i would never want my kids to ruin their lives, their physical and mental/emotional health, their marriages and family for me. HELLZ NO! trust me, i will end my life before i let my children ruin theirs over me. and THAT is what a GOOD PARENT does.

~~~~I have read all these posts and I understand the burn out. I cared for my parents from a distance. I live in Wisconsin and they in Montana.----- I did not do it day in, day out.~~~

freespirit, UNDERSTAND burnout?????!!!!! you really do not have a clue and cannot speak to the women in this thread.

we finally got rid of terrimerrits, do not be another one of her.

Oh...my...goodnes....OBMAJ ... terrimerrits must've returned under a different name? Ugh. I agree with PamelaSue, as usual. You don't have a clue.

Not everyone should be a caregiver. It doesnt make you a bad person if it's too much to handle. I work as a CNA in a nursing home and have residents who test our patience everyday. But we have a good staff and support system here to help each other. Maybe it's time to find a good nursing home for her.
Then you'll see when you visit her your time together will be more pleasant since you no longer have the stress of caring for her.
Talk to the hospitals social worker to find out what options are available to you. Ask about respite or having home health care workers coming to your home if a nursing home isn't possible. Good luck.

@Pamela--just reading some of the posts--and you were right! Chuckled when I realized it was you with the health issues and the 4 children and not funnierthanme! LOL Sorry for the mix up--goes to show the brain overload at times...but I am wondering now after these few months how Funnier actually is, and if anything has changed for her. I am praying so! xo