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VI. No Waiver of Your Rights. APFM does not (and may not) require or even ask consumers seeking senior housing or care services in Washington State to sign waivers of liability for losses of personal property or injury or to sign waivers of any rights established under law.I agree that: A.I authorize A Place For Mom ("APFM") to collect certain personal and contact detail information, as well as relevant health care information about me or from me about the senior family member or relative I am assisting ("Senior Living Care Information"). B.APFM may provide information to me electronically. My electronic signature on agreements and documents has the same effect as if I signed them in ink. C.APFM may send all communications to me electronically via e-mail or by access to an APFM web site. D.If I want a paper copy, I can print a copy of the Disclosures or download the Disclosures for my records. E.This E-Sign Acknowledgement and Authorization applies to these Disclosures and all future Disclosures related to APFM's services, unless I revoke my authorization. You may revoke this authorization in writing at any time (except where we have already disclosed information before receiving your revocation.) This authorization will expire after one year. F.You consent to APFM's reaching out to you using a phone system than can auto-dial numbers (we miss rotary phones, too!), but this consent is not required to use our service.
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Before my mom died, my step-father got lost going to his doctor. Mom ignored it even though he'd been diagnosed with mild dementia, or the beginning stages. Since her passing I've taken over as POA and trustee, etc. After a few falls I attempted to have him voluntarily give up the keys to no avail. He always insisted that he never had any problems driving and only travels in the neighborhood.
Then I got the call from his aid, "he isn't home and didn't sleep in his bed last night." Total panic set in as I sent out everyone looking while I called the emergency services and the hospitals. He's nowhere to be found. A few hours later we received a call from an ER doctor a couple of counties away, many miles away. "Your dad's here and spent the night. When can you get here?"
His memory of the event was a complete mess. He thought his car was in the hospital parking lot. He fell and hurt his head needing stitches and thought that was at Wal-Mart. No one could tell us if he walked in or was brought by ambulance. We looked for the car everywhere he said. Calling the police dispatch, at first they were no help, but a detective called back who overheard the call. He witnessed dad's fall and car, 20 miles away from where we were. How's that for pure luck?
Alls we can figure is dad was going back to where he lived many years earlier. To get the keys away I had to tell him the car was needing a lot of service and I was taking it in. I explained a few days later why I wouldn't be bringing it back. I got an earful but he finally understood after a sitting with it a few days.
We just can't trust a damaged mind. Get those keys before someone is hurt.
Very true story poster before. Elder still driving ( probably had Dementia), drove into field, got stuck. Passed due to sitting in the car during cold weather.
He did not know to get out of the car and go for help, though there was another story of an elder that did get out of the car, he still died because he fell and did not get up.
Elderley couple went to dinner at a family home. Familiar route. Would call to stay 'home safe'. This night, didn't. Police out looking. Found next morning, dangerously cold & confused but alive. Had stopped for fuel, apparently turned the wrong way when leaving & got on a country highway. Kept driving. Was a 40min drive home - but they kept driving for many hours! Drove past turnoffs to country towns, not thought to stop to ask directions or seek help. Eventually got so tired, pulled over to sleep.
Other elderley gent drove his car interstate. Took a regular trip every year. Until he got lost on route. Seen on video buying fuel then no trace.. took many days for search rescue team to find. Had left the highway onto smaller roads then bush tracks. Car found in very thick forrest. Man deceased.
My friends & I turned wrong after stopping for fuel after a country weekend stay in our 20s. Driving along.. very dark.. this feels wrong.. no phone compassess back then. But we used the signs & the moon's position to right ourselves. Country highways are dark & long here.
Everyone has been pointing out the dangers of letting him drive and I agree. It is hard to stop someone however, especially when there is still a car in the family. My mother lives about two hours away from me. She started calling me saying she was lost and I had to figure out where she was using her description of what was around her and the maps app on my phone. I tried to tell her to wait until I could get there to help her run errands rather than driving herself. I also got a tracker for her car, especially since one time she had called me from a very remote area at night. I tried to get her to not drive at all and especially not at night or such a time that the return trip would be in the dark but she wouldn’t agree to that. Fortunatly around that time a friend of mine offered to stay with her a few days a week and she started running errands. I have since found someone to come in the days that my friend is not there and both of them have not only been running errands but finding and taking her to fun things to do. She is a people person and enjoys the activities they find which she would never try to go to alone. She never officially stopped driving in her mind but she enjoys having someone to drive her and she hasn’t driven for quite a while now. She still says that if she has to come down my way and I am busy or tired she can drive herself. Obviously we all make sure that doesn’t happen! She also still talks about what her next car will be. I used to check the tracker occasionally when she was home alone and her car has only been driven by her caregivers. As an extra benefit, the trackers app lets me know if the battery is getting low and I have been able to give her caregivers a heads up so they can take appropriate actions before being stuck somewhere with a dead battery! (They know I don’t use it to check up on what they’ve been doing.) Good luck!
Uber is great. You can get a lot of Uber rides for the cost of insurance, gas, parking, tuneups, and car payments. Maybe treat him to a ride somewhere so he can see how convenient it can be. Also, the insurance company would likely not cover him for the new vehicle.
I put two Apple air tags in my husbands car, and I set up his air tags and his iphone in the "Find My" app on my iphone as well as his iphone. Because of the enhanced safety features of newer automobiles, I bought him a new car and then I programmed his most frequent destinations into the new car GPS. I also set up his most frequent destinations in the maps app on his iphone. I moved the apps to the front of his iphone and taught him how to use them. It was easy. I am 76 so if I can do it, anyone can. Also, Because he has mild cognitive impairment, I found a driving school that works with seniors. Most people our age did not have the option to take driving lessons and as we age, our senses don't work as fast in an emergency. Still, you can develop compensatory strategies just and be a safe driver. Initially, I sought driving lessons from a doctor referred occupational therapist. Instead of assessing his driving skills, she gave him a battery of neurocognive tests which he flunked because she spoke with very rapidly with a South African accent in a higher range than he could hear. Moreover, my husband retired in 2003 and throughout his career, he had a secretary. I find younger healthcare professionals judge elderly people to be cognitively impaired based on their expertise with technology. I have ADHD. it did not prevent me from obtaining multiple advanced degrees and a very successful career. Still, even in undergraduate school, I could never remember where I parked my car and I always got lost before the invention of the GPS. In my case, it has nothing to do with short term memory. Moreover, dementia does not happen all at once. It is on a continuam just like jogging and weight lifting. If you have a knee replacement, you get physical therapy. Whereas if you are diagnosed with cognitive impairment, some states like California take away your drivers license and you are isolated. PS. After my husband got used to his new hearing aids, he started passing cognitive tests and with practice learned to draw clocks so that he now tests as normal for his age. My husband is still a very smart man-just not as smart as he was 20 years ago.
...."so if I can do it, anyone can." Except those people with a broken brain who should NOT be driving under any circumstances, and endangering the lives of other innocent people on the roadways. Period, end of conversation!!!!
This may be helpful to some of us who don’t live near LO, and LO does not use a smart phone . GoGoGrandparent is a service to get Uber or Lyft rides . LO can call for rides . They match LO with vetted drivers with experience with elders including with cognitive issues . Family can set limits and monitor where LO is going as well. I have no first hand experience with this service . I was just searching . We don’t live near MIL and I was thinking about what she can do when she stops driving . She does not use a smart phone, tablet or computer.
This should be the least of your concern about your husband with dementia not remembering where his car is in a parking lot. What you should be very, very concerned about is your husband driving and the danger he poses to himself as well as to other people if he makes a wrong turn into oncoming traffic, etc. and gets into a deadly accident. It’s time for your husband to stop driving. Hide his car key or disable the car so he’s not going to pose a danger to himself and/or others.
The topic of an elderly, person who has multiple problems, yet is still allowed to drive, is a very hot topic for me. I will, AGAIN, post what happened to my 2 oldest children 30 years ago. My oldest son, and my only daughter went to the same school. They were coming home after school, when an old man pulled out from a side street, and into my son's lane. My son swerved hard to avoid t-boning the old man and his wife, on the old woman's side. He went over the curb and hit a large tree close to the road. If our 16 year old daughter had not been wearing her seat belt, she would have gone through the windshield and hit the tree head first. She had horrible bruises on her chest and shoulder from the seat belt. Our son only had minor injuries to his knee that hit the steering column. The old man pulled over, stared for a few moments at what he had done, then drove off. In the meantime, our daughter had written down his license number. The police did track the old man down and charged him. We didn't find out if they yanked his license away., but I sure hope so. Our children sustained only minor injuries. The old woman was not killed, thanks to our son. Our son's Camaro was totaled. To this day, our daughter still has PTSD from that accident. It's really hard for her to ride as a passenger in a car. We almost lost 2 of our 3 children because of a selfish old man who had no business being behind the wheel. PLEASE think about what your husband might do to someone else, it's not all about his tender feelings when he's on the road endangering other people.
Ma’am you need to take his keys away before he kills someone and they sue you for every penny. Try explaining that one— “well, I knew he had dementia and I knew he couldn’t find his car but I still thought it was a good idea for him to drive. It never occurred to me that someone with a broken brain might not be able to drive. I simply didn’t care that he was a danger on the road and killed an innocent person, your honor”
Someone else commented: "He could kill himself or others. If you allow this, you are responsible."
You might be morally responsible perhaps, but not legally. I asked an attorney. That doesn't make it any easier, I know....
This was a concern with my dad (86, with dementia) who lived 3.5 hours from me and would not stop driving. Some doctor at a hospital (presumable when he or my step-mother were there for one reason or another) contacted the DMV and he was not able to keep his license. I even took him down, got him an ID, and stood right there when the guy put a hole through his license because it was invalid, but later my dad did not believe it happened...said he still had his license.
It was a dilemma, as he already rolled over one of his cars in a single car accident. Luckily he was belted in and there was an airbag, but there was no stopping him. He kept driving their older van (my step mother, his wife of 50 years, passed away six months ago), and refused to stop. I knew if I somehow disabled his car, he would either fix it himself (he'd been a fix-it-yourself guy since he was 16 years old), or pay someone to fix it. If I was to put a club on his car he would just go buy a new car (some idiot would sell him one....). Attorney also told me I could not legally put the club on his car....
Luckily nothing ever happened, but yes I was constantly worried about him and others. I read where one person with dementia willingly gave up his keys after he determined he could not anticipate what the other drivers were going to do, but you certainly can't count on all of them to come to that conclusion....my dad never did.
Sorry about the duplicate posts. Not sure what is going on, but I could not completely delete them.
Amen to all the comments here! My husband can drive but he won’t drive because he doesn’t want to take the chance. You never know when the skill will drop off. When my Dad taught me to drive so many years ago he said, “You have a several thousand pound weapon here in this car. How would you feel if you killed a child?” You may want your to drive because it is difficult to take over all the driving but think “How would you feel if he killed a child?”
KathleenQ: You're so right! My mother exclaimed "A car is a weapon." I don't have a need for nighttime driving, but will occasionally as I don't want to lose that skill at age 77.
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You've had enough replies cautioning you against letting him drive. Everyone doing so is correct, and their various concerns are so true. When approaching this issue, I found that my major medical care system had an Occupational Therapy specialist who did driving evaluations, so we had that appt. It was about a 2 1/2 hour eval, with some computerized assessments, discussion, and a driving simulator. I was there to see how he did. It was fail after fail on all assessments--and this was at a time when I knew he should only drive very locally, if at all. What was helpful for me to grasp was that though the muscle memory of driving--the physical mechanics of driving would probably stay for a lot longer, his ability to perceive correctly, and to make judgments about driving situations, plus his ability to react quickly were all impaired. Our insurance covered that assessment. He accepted the outcome better than I think he would've based on just my saying so.
By proceeding, I agree that I understand the following disclosures:
I. How We Work in Washington.
Based on your preferences, we provide you with information about one or more of our contracted senior living providers ("Participating Communities") and provide your Senior Living Care Information to Participating Communities. The Participating Communities may contact you directly regarding their services.
APFM does not endorse or recommend any provider. It is your sole responsibility to select the appropriate care for yourself or your loved one. We work with both you and the Participating Communities in your search. We do not permit our Advisors to have an ownership interest in Participating Communities.
II. How We Are Paid.
We do not charge you any fee – we are paid by the Participating Communities. Some Participating Communities pay us a percentage of the first month's standard rate for the rent and care services you select. We invoice these fees after the senior moves in.
III. When We Tour.
APFM tours certain Participating Communities in Washington (typically more in metropolitan areas than in rural areas.) During the 12 month period prior to December 31, 2017, we toured 86.2% of Participating Communities with capacity for 20 or more residents.
IV. No Obligation or Commitment.
You have no obligation to use or to continue to use our services. Because you pay no fee to us, you will never need to ask for a refund.
V. Complaints.
Please contact our Family Feedback Line at (866) 584-7340 or ConsumerFeedback@aplaceformom.com to report any complaint. Consumers have many avenues to address a dispute with any referral service company, including the right to file a complaint with the Attorney General's office at: Consumer Protection Division, 800 5th Avenue, Ste. 2000, Seattle, 98104 or 800-551-4636.
VI. No Waiver of Your Rights.
APFM does not (and may not) require or even ask consumers seeking senior housing or care services in Washington State to sign waivers of liability for losses of personal property or injury or to sign waivers of any rights established under law.
I agree that:
A.
I authorize A Place For Mom ("APFM") to collect certain personal and contact detail information, as well as relevant health care information about me or from me about the senior family member or relative I am assisting ("Senior Living Care Information").
B.
APFM may provide information to me electronically. My electronic signature on agreements and documents has the same effect as if I signed them in ink.
C.
APFM may send all communications to me electronically via e-mail or by access to an APFM web site.
D.
If I want a paper copy, I can print a copy of the Disclosures or download the Disclosures for my records.
E.
This E-Sign Acknowledgement and Authorization applies to these Disclosures and all future Disclosures related to APFM's services, unless I revoke my authorization. You may revoke this authorization in writing at any time (except where we have already disclosed information before receiving your revocation.) This authorization will expire after one year.
F.
You consent to APFM's reaching out to you using a phone system than can auto-dial numbers (we miss rotary phones, too!), but this consent is not required to use our service.
Then I got the call from his aid, "he isn't home and didn't sleep in his bed last night." Total panic set in as I sent out everyone looking while I called the emergency services and the hospitals. He's nowhere to be found. A few hours later we received a call from an ER doctor a couple of counties away, many miles away. "Your dad's here and spent the night. When can you get here?"
His memory of the event was a complete mess. He thought his car was in the hospital parking lot. He fell and hurt his head needing stitches and thought that was at Wal-Mart. No one could tell us if he walked in or was brought by ambulance. We looked for the car everywhere he said. Calling the police dispatch, at first they were no help, but a detective called back who overheard the call. He witnessed dad's fall and car, 20 miles away from where we were. How's that for pure luck?
Alls we can figure is dad was going back to where he lived many years earlier. To get the keys away I had to tell him the car was needing a lot of service and I was taking it in. I explained a few days later why I wouldn't be bringing it back. I got an earful but he finally understood after a sitting with it a few days.
We just can't trust a damaged mind. Get those keys before someone is hurt.
Elder still driving ( probably had Dementia), drove into field, got stuck. Passed due to sitting in the car during cold weather.
He did not know to get out of the car and go for help, though there was another story of an elder that did get out of the car, he still died because he fell and did not get up.
Two stories I remember from our local news.
Elderley couple went to dinner at a family home. Familiar route. Would call to stay 'home safe'. This night, didn't. Police out looking. Found next morning, dangerously cold & confused but alive. Had stopped for fuel, apparently turned the wrong way when leaving & got on a country highway. Kept driving. Was a 40min drive home - but they kept driving for many hours! Drove past turnoffs to country towns, not thought to stop to ask directions or seek help. Eventually got so tired, pulled over to sleep.
Other elderley gent drove his car interstate. Took a regular trip every year. Until he got lost on route. Seen on video buying fuel then no trace.. took many days for search rescue team to find. Had left the highway onto smaller roads then bush tracks. Car found in very thick forrest. Man deceased.
My friends & I turned wrong after stopping for fuel after a country weekend stay in our 20s. Driving along.. very dark.. this feels wrong.. no phone compassess back then. But we used the signs & the moon's position to right ourselves. Country highways are dark & long here.
She never officially stopped driving in her mind but she enjoys having someone to drive her and she hasn’t driven for quite a while now. She still says that if she has to come down my way and I am busy or tired she can drive herself. Obviously we all make sure that doesn’t happen! She also still talks about what her next car will be. I used to check the tracker occasionally when she was home alone and her car has only been driven by her caregivers. As an extra benefit, the trackers app lets me know if the battery is getting low and I have been able to give her caregivers a heads up so they can take appropriate actions before being stuck somewhere with a dead battery! (They know I don’t use it to check up on what they’ve been doing.)
Good luck!
Where you parked the car is a short term memory problem.
But I'd be very wary here.
Spacial awareness, response time, provlem solving skills are also very much needed as part of wider 'driving skills' to be a safe driver.
So yes this man can probably drive the car. May drive well.
Driving a Car vs a wider view of Driving Skills may become the issue.
I have no first hand experience with this service . I was just searching . We don’t live near MIL and I was thinking about what she can do when she stops driving . She does not use a smart phone, tablet or computer.
We almost lost 2 of our 3 children because of a selfish old man who had no business being behind the wheel. PLEASE think about what your husband might do to someone else, it's not all about his tender feelings when he's on the road endangering other people.
Ma’am you need to take his keys away before he kills someone and they sue you for every penny. Try explaining that one— “well, I knew he had dementia and I knew he couldn’t find his car but I still thought it was a good idea for him to drive. It never occurred to me that someone with a broken brain might not be able to drive. I simply didn’t care that he was a danger on the road and killed an innocent person, your honor”
You might be morally responsible perhaps, but not legally. I asked an attorney. That doesn't make it any easier, I know....
This was a concern with my dad (86, with dementia) who lived 3.5 hours from me and would not stop driving. Some doctor at a hospital (presumable when he or my step-mother were there for one reason or another) contacted the DMV and he was not able to keep his license. I even took him down, got him an ID, and stood right there when the guy put a hole through his license because it was invalid, but later my dad did not believe it happened...said he still had his license.
It was a dilemma, as he already rolled over one of his cars in a single car accident. Luckily he was belted in and there was an airbag, but there was no stopping him. He kept driving their older van (my step mother, his wife of 50 years, passed away six months ago), and refused to stop. I knew if I somehow disabled his car, he would either fix it himself (he'd been a fix-it-yourself guy since he was 16 years old), or pay someone to fix it. If I was to put a club on his car he would just go buy a new car (some idiot would sell him one....). Attorney also told me I could not legally put the club on his car....
Luckily nothing ever happened, but yes I was constantly worried about him and others. I read where one person with dementia willingly gave up his keys after he determined he could not anticipate what the other drivers were going to do, but you certainly can't count on all of them to come to that conclusion....my dad never did.
Sorry about the duplicate posts. Not sure what is going on, but I could not completely delete them.
I don't have a need for nighttime driving, but will occasionally as I don't want to lose that skill at age 77.