My parents are in their 80s. My dad is still doing well but my mother is memory impaired. I think my dad will need help with her but is too proud to allow me to help although I keep offering. The issue is that my youngest brother is 47 years old and has never worked. My parents have always paid his bills. He does not have a disability that I think would qualify for any social security or such. He just feels entitled to have them support him, he has a PhD in Philosophy and has an attitude that he is "above" the working world. His obnoxious personality has precluded him working in academia and that is all he is technically qualified for other than low level jobs he considers himself too good for.
My parents seem to see themselves as immortal. They haven't prepared a will or any provision for my brother after death. They seem to have the attitude that there is plenty of time for that but I don't think so.
Does anyone have advice on how to proceed with this? I'd like to get my parents to set things up so that my brother gets some kind of annuity so he doesn't get a big inheritance and blows it all fast leaving him homeless. Since this situation has gone one so long, I don't think they should plan on leaving money to anyone else.
Currently they own a home worth about 500k which they plan to sell for their own eldercare, other than that there isn't much.
Autism does not prevent learning. Since your brother is capable of learning, he should be capable of learning enough people skills to work a job.
I have a son who was diagnosed at 3, and not mild. He had no meaningful speech until 5. He is now 29 and makes more money than his mother. He is somewhat lazy outside of work, but that is the fault of his parents (us), not autism.
On the other hand my educated SIL is too good for a job. She makes some money at a side business, but has always been propped up by Mom and Dad. Now they are gone, and much of her inheritance is gone in supporting her lifestyle. I am just hoping she does not show up at our door in need.
I think she probably resents that we have enough money, but it was our choice to live below our means. We have a trust for our children when we pass. We have money to take care of ourselves when we are older.
If your children are set, think of your own future next. You are not your brother's keeper.
A trust can be set up with someone else in charge when the parents pass. Make sure they understand the trust can also protect the remaining spouse should the other pass first, and will shield inherited money from probate and taxes. This is routine business for elder attorneys.
With a trust if one of trustees becomes incapacitated for any reason - the other can step in and take care of financials - including getting the house sold or even just a line of credit on it. As well as take care of family business.
A trust keeps government out of your business (and government never works for nothing). In their trust they can do a "special needs trust" for brother - would have to be "IF" there is anything left goes to him - perhaps with a fiduciary over the funds and dole it out as needed.
Otherwise I agree with others - this is your parent mess - if they don't fix it - don't get into it yourself or involve your family in it. You've done the right things with your family. They now need to fix their mess.
The wealthy in past generations would pay for their unmarried offspring's life (usually by keeping them in graduate or law school), whilst training/brainwashing that off-spring to think that obtaining/finishing their education was the only solution to life, yet what to do after that education is never technically discussed.
It doesn't make sense since it's so harmful especially since employment is never discussed outside of classic lawyer or banking positions ...while not advising their offspring how to obtain a law degree or their-suitable positions, which usually = obtained via networking or family connections.
This insane way of thinking brainwashes their off-spring into thinking regular employment is beneath them and to equating employment in any non-legal non-financial-position as being a failure.
Unfortunately failure is the ultimate thing to avoid, due to it being grounds for parental hatred towards their off-spring.
If he does land a job, he will be surprised with its rewards. If he were to be fired you can bet that he has been taught that filing for unemployment equates to being a failure at life, as is joining a union,etc.
In the real world without trusts etc. The brother evolves into being a "pompus" unemployable dbag. Unless he somehow gets mingled into the realm of decent hardworking people who are willing to undo those teachings, he's never going to change. He must surround himself with diversity in thinking most importantly decent real-world thinking
Riley2166, your post is more helpful, I just thought I would mention past generational bs-thinking is likely the source as to why her brother thinks as he does. It's a thinking that, since forever, has failed to benefit anyone, yet still exists; as you wrote it's a horror show. It truly is a horror show.
Is it the parents fault for living/teaching what they were taught works best?
I don't know, it's how they were raised, but it ruins lives. Anderson Cooper is one of the few who survived, yet he was raised by an artist and financially backed throughout his career while told to "follow your bliss," meaning Cooper could fail outside the wealthy bubble, with few worries (eviction, repossession, foreclosure, etc).
Obtaining a law degree is the best career plan for his personality; he still has time to take the LSAT and submit applications. Suggest that idea to the parents, with examples of previous wealthy families encouraging their sons to practice law, who eventually become judges, giving prominence to the family name.(appealing to their generation is best through examples of status).
thus far he did what many do, who are raised within that type of setting = obtain a PhD .... or other philosophy based degrees. Which vocationally are worthless, he likely didn't attempt the LSAT, or know to seek a law degree.
OP-Brother has been indoctrinated into old past generational thinking. Which sucks for the OP who was likely ignored or encouraged to get married (prior generational-solution for getting offspring settled).
Thankfully the OP got away, and needs to EXIT away from her parents and brother. OP must cut ties with them to protect herself from their bs, which will never change.
The father won't tell her anything, because he's a dbag too, likely who got his opportunities through his father through generational connections.
Asperger's might be the brother's thing, which wasn't considered as vocationally detrimental, until recently.
A hypothetical game plan: A) do not consult with parents at all. B) Schedule a free consult with a disability-focused lawyer C) Schedule a free consult with elder care/probate lawyer in the county in which your brother would actually live. D) Drop by a Social Security office, take a number, enter into the sign-in machine (looks like voting machine), put your reason for visit as "Representative Payee" - in case he does later get qualified as disabled. You aren't applying as RP, but want an explanation of what is needed for your brother. E) Go to your local bank - preferable where you already hold your own accounts and will be recognized by the staff F) Ask what trusts or accounts are offered for persons declared unable to manage their own money - you're not signing up for anyone, just seeking information. G) Talk with as many of these community entities prior to seeing the attorneys. You will be better prepared as to what questions to ask.
H) If your brother actually has any paper documentation of any type, gather it up (perhaps when he's not looking) and store it for safe-keeping. You've already explained you can not depend on your family to help with any of this work.
This will be a job getting him qualified and enrolled in whatever programs may suit his needs. Buy yourself some office supplies to organize information and documents. Keep a separate log or folder for contacts. Do not show these documents/notes to anybody except the requesting agency or bank.
After you have done all of this and any additional, you can set the stage as to what/where you will/won't help in the process. There are often annual renewal routines that you may participate in - if you so choose.
There are monthly, quarterly, or annual meetings where family input is preferred - but not required. If you're more pro-active for the first year or two, it puts his providers on notice that family is, basically, monitoring the situation. It communicates to the agencies they have someone to account to. It mostly results in your brother getting better care than if he is being dumped by family. So if you want the best for your brother, that's something to consider.
Did your parents ever buy him an individual private-pay health insurance plan or did he apply on the Obama exchange? A package plan - securing a health/psychology assessment as a starting point. If he was/is ever hospitalized insurance will be a primary focus. Once declared disabled, employment training of some type can be explored. For a starter, don't focus on his working - it won't happen until he is stabilized, one way or another.
Disability works as an insurance, meaning FICA in layman's terms works as payment towards the premium.Never worked = SSI, which is asset based for eligibility.
Your parents will be advised to move their primary home into an irrevocable trust, or minimally deed it to all of the siblings, whilst retaining rights to live inside that home, while they're alive.
Since your youngest brother is renting, ask your parents why they aren't paying his rent towards a mortgage, with the house deeded in an irrevocable trust with all of the offspring as beneficiaries, to keep that house out of their "estate" to qualify them for Medicaid when they need a nursing home.
A nursing home will get everything, of that 500k, which is normal for U.S. retirement plans Overseas, Brits are allowed to pass their stuff onto the next generation while receiving government assistance, to hopefully keep the next generation off the doles (welfare).
500k will pay for a few years, since $10,000/month is a typical monthly nursing home charge. Which equates to to Medicaid, as the payer for their end-time inside a nursing home. Which will best occur inside a nursing home with both private and medicaid payers.
As you mentioned your parents are not considering real-life factors, and have created a man-child, who needs to be assessed for Asperger's, if he is mentally challenged then he might qualify for something, which might open-up eligibility for placement into an institution (Kennedy eradicated those in the 60s, due to the abuse his sister endured). Otherwise, you have a hot mess unfolding and will need to consult with your other siblings and possibly have your parents declared mentally "incapacitated," so their best interests can be collectively addressed.
1. I haven't read all the posts here but skimmed through some of them.
2. I write from personal experience as well as that of others who've addressed similar problems.
3. It is not my intention to be rude or critical, but to offer insights into directions different from those (a) I would have taken a few years ago, and (b) which are based on experience of others in a situation like this.
I've become aware of people who may be geniuses or extremely smart in their own rights, but incapable of functioning as self sustaining or self sufficient individuals. They may have eidactic memories, they may be brilliant, but they often have other qualities that act against even modestly functioning in society.
a. They believe, and may be, geniuses. But their arrogant attitude and condescension of others prevents them from getting and keeping jobs, and getting along with others.
b. They are absolutely resolute in their superiority and completely unwilling to consider that anyone can offer them advice or insight equal to or superior than their own.
c. They often direct their contempt toward women, including family members, and co-workers.
d. They are unwilling to change.
e. They can't get along with co-workers because others are so "stupid."
f. Although I don't know what the mental health issues might be of these people, there's one overriding attitude: they don't need to change b/c they're sooooo smart, they're right and others are wrong.
g. They either legitimately can't change, or don't feel it necessary. I have no medical or scientific support for this, but I think the mental balance is high on the brilliant side and low if not non-existent on the practical side. Some of these guys are literally geniuses, but they can't even manage their own income.
g. So it's useless to think that any changes are possible. And that includes caring for older parents, treating siblings respectfully, supporting themselves, pulling their own weight, or contributing to family activities.
It's better for siblings to recognize this and don't consider trying to rehab them, or expect them to think rationally and take care of themselves.
Estate planning: they will expect to get as much as they can, w/o contributing anything, including care to the parents. One way to address this is to structure a trust that does NOT provide them any cash, but pays funds on their mortgage, or utility bills. A trustee should handle this, and a good trust attorneys can set this up. Keep control of asses away from them.
This may be the best way to approach your parents, i.e., caring for this son after they're gone. Create the mechanisms now so they're in place when your parents are gone.
The men will not be grateful though. Don't expect any gratitude. And you may wish to sever relations after your parents are gone. Otherwise, you'll be stuck caring for someone who is used to relying on others to provide support for him.
I don't think these kinds of brilliant but impractical people are practically capable of caring for themselves, so this should be the focus of estate planning. A trust can ration disbursements, but when the financial assets run out, these individuals are going to have to fend for themselves. And that's NOT your problem, even if this man is your brother.
Regardless of how much you try to help, you'll never be able to meet your brother's desires. Recognize that, and move on when you're ready. Otherwise, obligations will be a noose around your neck.
And he is NOT your responsibility. While it's understandable that you are concerned for a sibling, recognize that this would be for the rest of your life, since he's also being enabled when people reach out to provide the care and support he's unwilling or unable to provide for himself.
Accept they exist but don't make excuses for them to do nothing.
Without your father’s care, your mother will be unable to deal with the house sale, will presumably need to go to a facility almost immediately, and will start incurring the massive bills we all know so well. Her needs may well be treated by the court as needing more immediate consideration than those of your brother – he would probably need that ‘autism’ diagnosis to get much sympathy from the court. Your brother’s fraction to be inherited by the usual rules won’t amount to much anyway.
So you can put it to your father that if he were to die suddenly and unexpectedly, your mother would be in a complete mess and your brother would be in trouble too. He shouldn’t want to plunge the whole family into a complex court case in addition to grief for him, serious problems in caring for your mother’s needs, family stress in clearing out the house, and no considered provision at all for your brother. His pride about caring for your mother might be enough to get him to go to a lawyer, if only to check out whether you are telling him is right. (And this would be the exact truth in many if not most jurisdictions, other than those based on community property.)
Perhaps you could copy this into a letter, saying this is what you have been told by a lawyer somewhere else (true). It is a good statement of the ‘big problem’ he is setting up. Good luck!
Sorry!
1) if mom needs extra care, such as MC or NH, it will deplete their assets
2) if dad becomes ill or dies, mom will need a LOT of care sooner, depeleting assets even faster
3) if the plan is to sell the house so they can pay for AL/MC/NH, that WILL get sucked down quickly, especially if it isn't properly invested in a trust - there may BE no inheritance to worry about for Blunder Boy
4) if they die with no will before or after the house is sold (if there ARE still assets), it can take TWO YEARS or sometimes even MORE for it to all get through probate courts, so BLUNDER BOY will have NOTHING coming in for all that time.
Get dad to understand the issues at hand, which only impact him, your mom and your brother, if that's how they want it. THEN wash your hands of the whole business.
You have no obligation to care for a grown-*ss man. While it is nice of you to want to help your parents, despite their behavior towards you when suggesting they stop enabling him, you also have no real obligation to help them. You have offered, you can try making a final plea via a written letter, but there's no point to fretting or worrying about their situation if they are not willing to work with you.
As for Blunder Boy, if his thought process is so godly, perhaps it can pay his bills and feed him!!!
Trusts are not only for the wealthy, but expect to pay $3k to draw one up.
A good elder attorney can give the best options for your state. You are right that getting the parents to do something is the hard part.
You are so right about washing your hands after that. Your own marriage and kids should not suffer.
I got my parents talking about wills, POA, and what they wanted when I told them I wanted to do mine. It broke down that wall of don’t discuss such things. Or the “not yet syndrome” I was fortunate enough to be caring for an uncle who’s own Will was so out of date he was leaving money to 3 people who had already died - which also helped them realise the importance of doing one and checking it regularly.
Since that might not be an option - could you suggest that you’d like to know their wishes since they are in their 80’s - what they want finance and health wise should they suddenly become ill. Remember to mention that wills and POA’s are about ensuring their wishes are carried out rather than decided by a court because they hadn’t made it legally binding.
They should be very proud of you, you are thoughtful and compassionate
One point - My wife and I were in charge of everything for all four parents who passed in the last four years. All were a little different for arrangements (annuities, insurance, IRAs, wills, trusts, joint survivorship accounts). By far the easiest to handle is the trust, even though we were pretty lucky with the wills. Wills seem to be more like suggestions which can take a lot of time and effort to resolve. Especially if they are contested. Trusts are a little pricey up front, but are by far the best. Lots of misconceptions about trusts. I am not a lawyer, but I had to deal with all combinations of arrangements in the last four years.
2.Need a trust ASAP. ..focus only on parents!!! Need something very soon while has some lucid moments to sign. Get on top of parents medical. Call all doctors ,financial institutions, etc. If you really want to help you, have to commit to it. They need help.
We may be faced with a similar issue in my family - a freeloading member living with an elderly parent. When the time comes, her house will be sold and that individual will have to fend for themselves. It's a simple as that. Whatever profit comes from the house is supposed to be split among siblings but there are seven sibs and the house is in awful condition so there won't be much to split.
I agree with others here that you have no obligation to your sibling. He had one job to do and that was to take care of himself as an adult. If he is mentality and physically capable, there is no excuse for not supporting himself financially.
You ready? Here it is.
Never take on the emotional work someone else didn’t do and allow it to become your burden.
If not disabled, so be it.
If disabled, a sit-down chat with Dad & professional advice, legal, social work etc.
If your parents are massive enablers, unwilling to make plans & expect you to step into their boots - I do feel for you. That pressure is mine & I am seeking councelling to assist.
You sound like a caring soul. I am glad you have started to get help - it may be a long or short road but you want to be still walking along as your parents age & health changes, not crushed under a steamroller your brother will drive over you.
You must formulate a continuing strategy now, on how to respond to what may become increasing demands on his part. He knew how to manipulate his parents...has practiced it for years...and he's obviously very intelligent. Is he a drug user (and did his parents hide this out of shame? I'm just wildly guessing). If so, he could become truly dangerous to you and others. Just how MIGHT he react if he cannot get his way? Above all, you must present a united front. At all costs, avoid inconsistent responses to him.
Sorry to present such a scary scenario. But I would hate to see you caught off guard.
Agreed they need to get their "affairs" in order, but when you have tried multiple times (OP has) and they don't see the need "yet", what is the point of harping on it? Seems like some negative family vibes going on - can't change those either. Just brings more stress on you trying to get them to see the sense/need. At most I would perhaps try one more time, but then that's it. Leaving anything about yourself out of the picture, focus on their needs and how they plan to deal with brother's "needs." You can't make them do it. You can't change how they view things. If nothing changes, then just visit if/when you can/want, love them and leave them.
Hugs 🤗