Has anyone experienced being in the sandwich generation?

I never realized I was such a push over. Dads car battery died Sunday. The SIL took him to church and my daughter picked him up., You would think SIL would plug the one of many chargers I have here to charge the battery... nope. So I did and got him by for a day. Yesterday I took his battery out and got a new one. Dad did come down as I was installing it ready to help me take it out.... I did get a think you but not "how much was it"?, nope, nothing. So I guess I am just expected. He did research it the night before and found a very expensive one... It was just easier for me to get it and install it rather than deal with him having no wheels and me having to deal with that. I surely wont let him use my spare car or my new truck. I hate to be this way. I made a nice dinner last PM, at least everyone liked it..... So tonight I have to work (yes 14 hour days for me some times) so "yall are on your own" ... which means my wife has to cook.....
I'm just tired. I was so grumpy last PM I didn't get to enjoy the trick or treaters as when the door bell rang dad yells out "is someone going to answer the door"? While my wife has to herd the dogs.
Exhausted is my term now. Having an office in the house, taking care of at least 2 dogs (vs my doors getting torn up).
It is easy to say get out by a certain date. I want a good relationship with my daughter. I saw how a difficult relationship with in laws as with my parents (one loser for a sister in-law, gone and one grumpy one brother in law). I took care of my in-laws as much as I could. They were very self sufficient even with my FIL having a major stroke and speaking very little English.
Dad cant live on his own, it just wouldn't work, it would be more work for me. In the end this is a has to be. He doesn't know what it is like to be on his own, he was for 8 months while I made bi weekly trips across 7 states to take care of things. He can but it would be a disaster, then Id have to do clean-up anyway, medical, physical, everything else.
As far as kids, one is totally on her own making her way without any help (OK I pay her cell phone and some trips home to see us). She got it, college, good job, move out, be on your own. I don't want to be the heavy but I don't want to see this be a year or 5 down the road. I will probably stroke out by then.
Besides saying you have so many days how do I get this point across? I do have a time to be with my daughter one on one soon so maybe I can get out of her what their plans are. The SIL is just weeks away from a permanent position with the new job so every day I wait for the other shoe to drop.
30 days has turned into 4 months.......
I'd say I would start serving crappy food but they would eat it anyway. Maybe I will go on strike for making meals..... see how that goes...... we did give up cleaning their areas bedrooms and bathrooms. I have no idea what our hall bathroom is like. Gave up on dads rooms months ago..... oh the smell.... I have to vacuum his living room once in a while when he is not around because that is in full view of when people come to the house. Otherwise when he is home he makes comments about the maids..... which is right up there with the "Chef" comment while I am cooking. Last night again he made it, "I thought I was being nice"...... no, it is because I am not "YOUR chef".... I am not an "employee" nor is my wife "your maid"..... you see where I am going with this?

Sometimes, a lot of the time, it is easier to do things our self rather than waiting for someone else. Almost any life lesson we teach our kids can be like that, (it is so much easier to make the beds, do the laundry, clean the house etc than to have to put up with a half a$$ed job or nag constantly) but the consequences of that are that they never learn to do those things and never feel the satisfaction of a job well done. In the workplace there may be people who are slackers, but when we go ahead and do the things they leave undone they will never be called to account.
There are consequences to us as well; the time that has been stolen from us when we cover for others. It's not only the actual time spent cleaning, cooking etc, it is the extra hours spent working at paid employment to cover the extra expenses involved and the toll on our physical and mental health. TG, I think we all see your dilemma and we despair that you are completely unable to help yourself. Nothing has changed for the better since you first posted, in fact your burdens have increased with the addition of your daughter and SIL. I wonder where you will be in a year from now?

"It is easy to say get out by a certain date. I want a good relationship with my daughter. "

This one sentence rang home for me. My mother is probably the ultimate enabler and my one brother has never grown up because he has never had to. She used to let one son or another live with her and be totally supported and cleaned up after and I have always been convinced that she has been afraid that if she did anything different, then they wouldn't love her anymore.

I'm going to give you a little tough love. If they have so little regard for your feelings, your home, or your anything, what relationship are you so worried about losing? If they love you, they will love you after you force them to stand on their own. If they don't they never will, regardless of how much you do for them. Boot them out and see which one it always was.

Tgengine wrote:

"I am the nice guy who cant say no."

"I never realized I was such a push over."

"Dad cant live on his own, it just wouldn't work, it would be more work for me."

"30 days has turned into 4 months......."

TGengine, the best thing you can do for yourself is recognize your weaknesses and limitations and start adapting to them instead of posting repeatedly complaining about them. This complaint has been going on for months, you justify the situation, yet complain about it, find excuses or limitations to prevent change that would help you find your status and self respect that you seem to have lost.

Nothing's going to change if you don't force it. Recognize it and accept your limitations. We all have them. It's better to learn how to deal with them than pretend you want tochange - you can't change their behavior and have demonstrated tolerance for it.

Why should they change when they have a nice cushy doormat who enables them?



CWillie:

"TG, I think we all see your dilemma and we despair that you are completely unable to help yourself. Nothing has changed for the better since you first posted, in fact your burdens have increased with the addition of your daughter and SIL. "

Yes, so true. But despair only lasts so long, and some of us have realized this situation is not going to change regardless how many threads are started and how many helpful posts are written.


Mom2Mom:

"I'm going to give you a little tough love. If they have so little regard for your feelings, your home, or your anything, what relationship are you so worried about losing?"

Also yes, so true. A subordinate, doormat type relationship isn't worth preserving.

But, through all his posts, there are just more and more complaints to the point that it's time to recognize that suggestions are fruitless. Those who disagree should read his earlier posts.

Hi Tgengine and all who have provided wonderful advice: I know Tgengine has posted about these issues previously. Maybe he just needs to vent and have us give ideas and suggestions and somehow it helps him. My stepmom was in a situation where she was extremely frustrated at being a walk over and would vent to me, I and others would give advice, which it appeared she didn't take. It turns out that is what she needed to keep going. She knew she should make the changes we suggested and was extremely resentful for being in the situation - but didn't take the hard steps. Finally I realized that she was not likely to - it was not her personality - but she still needed an outlet for venting. She did like the suggestions too - it gave her options to mull over. Well, after 7 years - she finally did make the hard choice - stood up for herself, kicked out moochers and shut off the money tap. And you know what? They didn't starve, or go bankrupt. They didn't even feel resentment that she kicked them out. She wishes she would have done it years earlier.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that let's be patient with Tgengine - keep reinforcing to him that he is not the bad guy, that he needs to kick out the kids, he needs to shut off the cash to dad, and keep letting him know he can vent. Eventually things will change - either he will take the steps or someone else will. But we are all on Tgenine's side.

Tgengine - one more thing. My mom sounds a lot like your dad - she blew through 250K from her divorce, never saved, always needed money for cell phone, rent, car insurance etc. She retired and only had $500/month - nothing else. Finally I and my sister got tired of seeing new junk in her apartment every visit but she had not enough money for rent. We shut her off.

She didn't go out on the street. WE worked with local aging services to find an apartment pegged to her income - which is beautiful and she loves. She manages for herself on $500/month - all her expenses. I wouldn't rule out getting dad into a senior living community on his own. People are as helpless as you let them be.

Absolutely true Kimber, I empathise with Tgengine and I think it is important that he comes here to vent. I also think he needs to hear from people who can give a different message than the one he is hearing from those around him and from that little voice inside that keeps telling him he should not only give (and give and give) but be happy about it.

TG, on days that you're not there for dinner, could Mrs. TG let the others know that they're on their own to cook? Sounds like she could use a breather too, and they've proven they're more than able to fix their own meal.

Dear TG, I'm not sure why you think your dad might ask how much the baettery cost, or that he might say "thank you". Is this something he's done in the past? Do you think he might do b it because you would? And because it would be the right thing to do?

That's not your dad's personality, not his temperment. He resents that he's not Lord of the Manor. He resents you and tries to belittle you. He engages in passive aggressive actions and you fall into the trap every single time.

Your daughter and son in-law appear to be master manipualtors and users. You are likewise playing into their game.

It's really very sad to read your posts.

And again, i would make sure dad gets a neurocognitive evaluation. Might just be a personality disorder. But he could have Mild Cognitive Impairment.

I agree! Give them the boot!!

I am trying. Last night everyone was out (did not not know until last minute) This is why I do not plan dinner until last minute now. So my wife and I tried to enjoy a few hours of quiet.... 3 dogs running around.... Oh well. It was nice tho. When the kids came home we mentioned a place to rent that is where they want to be. Now after my pushing to buy vs. rent they say "no we are looking to buy rather than rent now"...... so now they decide to listen to me but the down side is they cant get a mortgage until they fix some credit issues. This will take some time which means they are moving out anytime soon!...... Aragh!
I have to watch what I say.... Plus the SILs truck broke down, hopefully he can fix it today... of course he has to wait for his check to buy parts...." what do you have to wait for, you don't have any expenses, you live here rent and food and truck payment free, what are you doing with your money?" I don't get it.
This AM my daughter starts my spare car in the garage and goes into to let it warm up...... I have a below grade garage.... As I was going out the door I quietly told her NO, don't warm the car up inside the garage, she will kill us with CO poisoning.... The car is IN the garage, it is already warmed up. Apparently she was not happy with me. I can't believe after all my years in the fire service she did that.....
This is what I live with!
It is making living with dad look like a dream!

Tell the kids to rent the apartment and use that to start fixing their credit. You are too much a pushover. Put on big-boy pants and get them O U T. Your posts seem to give your daughter a break - she is just as bad as the SIL and acting like a spoiled teenager. You are doing no favors for them. Time for tough love.

TG, here's the thing. You "mentioned" to the kids about renting rather than buying.

Let that sink in for a minute. I'm sure that when someone "mentions" something to you, you take the hint and act on the hint without further direction. Your daughter is not made that way. Neither is son in law, or your dad. They are made of sterner stuff.

You are going to need to say, "we're putting an expiration date of your staying here; you need to be out by December 1st." Or, you need to say "we're putting an expiration date on your staying here for free; here is the rental agreement. the terms are generous; please let us know by Monday if you are signing and getting this notorized, or if you'll be moving out in two weeks".

It's not a Question or an insinuation. It's a demand.

And the warming up the car inside the garage thing; clearly your daughter was not paying attention to you or to anyone who taught her any science in school.

TG, you are going to have to learn a whole different way of communicating with this particular child of yours AND with your dad. It needs to be direct, short and with a consequence. I think back to when your dad was walking around with the knife blade pointing out and he said "I'm too old to change". I think I would have said "then you're too dangerous to live here".

YOUR behavior is going to have to change before your living circumstances do.

This is going a bit off off topic, but Baba's post reminded me of a story...

Bil and sis were visiting a couple they know and the hour was getting late. Sis was getting antsy because the couple had mentioned several times what a busy day they had coming up, then the yawns started. Finally the wife excused herself and returned in her nightgown and robe and told them she was heading for bed. BIL still couldn't understand why sis dragged him home (was quite POed actually), the hubby was still up...

The moral of the story, with some people subtle doesn't cut it, even rudeness doesn't always get the message across, you need to spell it out in BLOCK LETTERS!

Exactly. People come in different flavors, with different levels of social/emotional intelligence.

In my family, if you said "I'm sorry I cant come that weekend" it was understood that you didn't want to attend the event. It was a well-understood code.

Imagine my shock when i said to my new MIL, "no, we can't come visit next weekend, I have paper due on Monday". She told me i could just do my paper during the week and it would be just fine for us to make the 3 hour bus ride that weekend. I quickly learned that "code" and subtlties didn't work on that family.

If you were on the job, the structure is on fire, a child is inside, and you need them to vent the roof. Would you just mentioned it in a vague way? Probably not.
Or on a wildland fire, you are in a drainage, mid slope (where you shouldn't be anyway), the weather changes, thunderstorms on the way. Would you hint that they needed to get the hell out of there? Think Storm King, 30 Mile, Loop Fire.
No, you need to use the same tone of voice, and attitude that you would use in those situations. Your house (both real and figurative) is on fire. You need to get them out. You need to be clear, especially with family who have no desire to move.

Contact an attorney. He'll get them out!

I get it...... working on that. I am not being subtle anymore, Using direct (clear) language. Tired of being subtle. I work all day and many nights and weekends so I am tired especially taking care of the house. Found a way to fix the dog poop problem. "Contractors at the house, there is a bucket with a poop scoop next to it, use it when you take YOUR dog out!" So far it is working, except dad, he just leaves his dog out.... One step at a time I guess.
Dinner "Are you guys home tonight"? NO? Fine, making dinner for me, it's at 6 if you are here or not.....
Time has arrived to make some hard decisions.
Dad is getting more socially involved, it seems to be helping. Wife and I are just doing our thing......

So glad you are moving forward TG!

Stopped making dinner for everyone, just when necessary or when I feel like cooking. Ive been busy working evenings, my wife eats whenever she wants and everyone else is left to fend for themselves. Daughter said don't make a big dinner we will eat whatever. OK, with that said a lot of pressure off. Next week I'm on travel so it's John Wayne time, you are on your own.
That feels better........

Way to go TG! It hard making that first step but everyone is happier in the end and moving forward becomes easier. Keep up the good work. Look forward to hearing updates.

Keep it up! Great to hear you've made progress in setting boundaries for yourself.

TG, congratulations! I'm sure that step forward was a hard one, but the rewards should support and encourage you. Hang in there!

TG, so happy to read your last 2 posts. You are on a good course. It took a lot of "working up to this" for you -- and here's the payoff. Stay firm and stay sane! (You need to be This Guy full-time. No more stewing and no more "reaction mode." Assert yourself 100% of the time. That's the only way it will sink in with this crowd.) We're rooting for you.

It has been challenging but getting there. I have just had to realize that this is a long term project.
I make dinner for my wife and I, if anyone chooses to eat then that is fine. I have enough, any extra is leftovers for my lunch.
I don't make weekend breakfasts any longer. Tired of waiting for people to get up. I'm up at 5 AM, so coffee is on and I make breakfast for my wife and I.
Daughter and SIL took dad out for birthday dinner, was so nice to have dinner with my wife at home and able to talk. Outside of the daughters dog attacking dads dog and me just about having a heart attack it was a pleasant 90 minutes..... 90 minutes, that is all my wife and I got but we made the best of it.
Working and travel all week, made a crock pot dinner so my wife doesn't have to cook.
Kids are eating out more, that is a good thing. Everyone is on their own at this point. I have to stop caving to stress which is slowly killing me.
Not worrying about dad anymore, he does his thing. Although we had friends over this this weekend. He made the crack when they came in "oh you made dinner for me"? He is the first thing they see when coming in the door (the room he is in is off the main door. He always has to make it about him. I did finally invite him to join us then had to change many topics to keep the conversation about others and not him.
He is supposed to go to my sisters for thanksgiving and hunting. I hope to great weather so he can go. We plan to have my 86 yo neighbor over and her 2 kids from out of state. Nothing big just us and one daughter and the neighbors.
So time to focus on my wife and I and everyone else can do what ever! Done worrying.

My father had to set a deadline to get my brother to move out. Took him 4 years but he bought himself a nice house with the rent-free money he had saved while living off my father. During that time, father suggested he contribute something toward the household expenses, which he never did, and he never did any household chores. My father is much happier with him gone.

Am I a bad parent /son for wanting my house back? Dad left for 2 weeks on vacation, hunting... yea! Still have 2 kids at home and 3 dogs....now dealing with SIL that does not get it. leaves doors open, lights on, puts dirty dishes in with the clean ones in the dishwasher after saying he would unload the dishwasher. We are putting sunroom on for and he asks if that will now be the smoking room? He smokes, we don't, yeah, I m spending north of 40K just so you can smoke in a nice warm place? I've abut had it. I give my nice warm sunny office to dad for his living room, I am in the basement office now and everyone leaves the basement garage door open and I get frozen out. His dog is on my couch.......... I talk, I ask, I leave notes....... I just want my house back.....

TG, I think you know what our answers will be as to standing your ground. But it seems as if SIL is fighting back.

These kinds of family challenges are never going to be easy, nor will they be straightforward and immune from some slippage. Your earlier post was more positive, upbeat. Now I see you're kind of down again.

SIL is a big sponge, to put it bluntly. He's irresponsible, predatory, lazy and could be described by a lot of other unflattering adjectives, including arrogant, inconsiderate and irresponsible.

I honestly would give him the boot, even if it means he has to grow up and learn to be responsible for himself. I think as long as he's sponging off you and refusing to cooperate or help, you're going to be faced with the Russian progress philosophy - two steps forward and one step backward. He's literally a noose around your neck.

I don't recall if you daughter and SIL are making any efforts at all to move, but I think that is both the short term and long term solution to SIL's menacing behavior. You set down rules, he challenges and pushes back. Maybe this is a man thing and he needs to be the king of your castle?

I might even get some boxes, start packing, and put his stuff in the garage or even outside. And accompany it with a deadline.

As long as Mr. Sponge is living in your house, I think you're going to be faced with this King of the Castle issue.

It sounds to me like SIL has no respect for TG because TG has been a pushover about the dogs, about his dad, about his daughter, etc. We teach people how to treat us and SIL may well be treating TG this way because he sees others doing it and getting away with it. SIL may also feel entitled to use the sunroom to smoke because TG accepts bad behavior from others in the household. TG will never get his house back until he establishes and **enforces** healthy boundaries.