The cow isn't the only one who lost its life.

That peak in adrenaline can add a lot of energy. I don't know how I would handle that kind of nasty. Probably from a safe distance. That really peeved me that she pushed your husband down, Cher. I've heard that mean people live forever, so you may be right that she'll be one of the 3%. Heaven help you and us.

Littleedie, like you, we had my husband's Dad living with us since his wife passed away 13 years ago, a Narcissistic himself, he groomed us both together and independently, saying things like "if anything should happen to Mother", or "ya know I cant live alone, if Mother dies, can I come live with you?", and definitely a lot of carrot dangling, even going so far to him saying he will buy all sorts of big ticket items for our home and such.

My MIL passed away, funeral stress with his other 2 kids, our youngest child (girl, 21) moved out, built a big shed to house all of the things he couldn't get rid of (never to be spoken about or seen again), and 2 weeks later, FIL moved in. This is a second marriage for both of us (though together now for 31 years) but we both brought 2 kinds each into this marriage, so we had Never been Alone in our marriage, Never!

He's PERFECT! that is his descriptive word, "the Dr says I'm Perfect", "My lab tests are Perfect", "I feel Perfect just Perfect"! I hate that word!

For me, his Narcissism slowly revealed itself over time, it was leaning curve for me, as I had never knowingly dealt with one on a regular basis, let alone lived with one. He kept it well hidden in the short, frequent (few hours) visits we had with them over the years. I didn't know anything about Narcissism, until I joined this site, nor did my husband, he just thought his Dad was Tyrannical when he was growing up! My husband comes from a very Dysfunctional family. All 3 siblings were/are completely disconnected.

He moved in, and 4 months later he was diagnosed with stage 4 Mantle Cell Lymphoma (agressive). He did very well with treatment, 11 months of Chemotherapy, and has been on a Watchful Waiting status ever since. The long slow decline, every day consuming our independence, well you know. He's nearly 87 now, and Perfect except for mobility issues, his Narcissism (which he knows nothing about), and he is now heading down the rabit hole of Dementia, and his long term memory is shot.

My husband and I have not been away alone together in about 4 years now, except for one overnight last Feb, when my daughter stayed with him.

No help nor interactions with his other 2 kids whatsoever. They live out of state, and now I know why. Both of them took well advantage financially of their parents, probably because of the abuse and suffering they dealt with as kids, and my husband (the baby of the family) was the only one who stayed close and kept them in our lives, with our 4 kids, we actually had a good relationship with them, while his Mom was alive. He watches TV in his study from early morning til bedtime, while my husband waits on him hand and foot. That's our life now, until we can figure out other suitable living ideas, that he can afford, as I don't want him back on my porch, should his money run out while living in Assisted living, but we are trying to figure out this type of arrangement now, he's ruining our lives. After 13 years of this, it's our time now! Weve definitely made some mistakes in this living arrangement. We never should have promised him he could live with us, and we should have gotten him into a Senior apartment from the get go. Livecand learn huh?

Anyhoo, welcome to this site! Ive made great friends and have learned so much! Welcome!

My inlaws never cared for a parent either, but he saw the care that went into my own parents, a delightful shared adventure along with my 5 siblings, and thought it Perfectly appropriate to infringe on our home, marriage and life, after all we had 2 vacant bedrooms!

I came from a pretty normal family, with great loving parents and all 6 of us very close to one another. 5 of us have had to deal with an inlaw living with them for some time or another, but non as long as us. It's not fair, it's not right, but there you have it. I was brought up knowing that it's just what you do. Boy was I Wrong!

Thanks golden23,Pam and Jessie bell for addressing my Mom. All you guys are correct.Interesting that Dad died at 90,( so he was one of the 30%) Mom had sepsis in 2012,brought her back to life, broken hip in 2013 and got it fixed perfectly. And a bunch of illnesses in-between and kidney cancer and comes back stronger than ever except for increase dementia. Does not know how to pick out clothes herself, does not know how to work the heat or air conditioner controls, can not follow simple direction for micro-wave or oven.. Cannot make out bills anymore etc.etc. ( you get the idea). But she sounds very well spoken on phone. So she can fool people quite well. When she was living with us she went after my husband when the visiting nurse was there to see her never the less. The nurse saw what happened and said we had to get her in assisted living or someplace so she would not hurt anyone. My so glad that someone else saw. So that is where she is now except they would not take her into the regular side of AS living so she is in the dementia side. Could not keep her in our house any longer because I have enough trouble taking care of my husband. Thanks again! And littledie please keep posting. There are great people on this site.

Well, just learned a very important lesson. Write your comment in Word on the PC or Notes on the ipad, then copy it to here. I left this tab, came back, and all was lost :(

I'd love to try again, but I smell something funny downstairs...

Quickly, I've been reading Leaving Home by David Celani, and another book of his re Fairbiarn's theory. Really good re the mind toggling between hope and hatred.

Thanks for sharing your stories, insights, and opinions. You all are so helpful!

Another thing you can do is use your right-mouse-click copy for your post before you submit it. Then if it gets lost you can paste it again. I lost a long, carefully thought out post the other day without copying it. Rats. I didn't have the mental energy to write it again.

I haven't read the whole thread but am I in the minority when I say that it's kind of sad that you wish the news had been bad and your Mom is heading off to death?

Sense of humour is great. I'm all for that but it saddens me how many care givers on here are just hoping and praying for their loved ones to die. Yes, it's hard. I've been there. But in my case, I adored my Mom and would love it if she was still alive.

And before I get a big pile of whoop a** responses.......let me clarify that this is just my opinion and I'm throwing it out there.

Gershun, most caregivers who are "wanting" their parent to die are not actually wishing for the parent's death. They are wanting to put down the load they've been carrying and get back to their own lives. Some are wanting the years of suffering to end, because they share the suffering. The caregivers are wanting to wake up in the morning without feeling the rushed and stressed. I don't know who on here said anything about wishing for their parent's death, but I do understand what they are saying. It is saying that the burden has become so great and the suffering too long for whatever reason. If we look at it in that light, we know that wishing for death is understandable.

Unfortunately, there are many caregivers who are so beaten down by it all that they wish for their own death. I understand that, too. I wish we had some better solutions to help caregivers. The problem is so big, since many elders need 24/7 help for years.

Gershun, your mom sounds like she was a sweetheart. The parents on this thread are the narcissists, the borderline personality, the users and abusers that suck the life out of their caregivers and complain that there is not more left. The ones who frequently didn't take care of their own parents, but demand that their children take care of them at their home (my in-laws hope, but my absolute deal breaker in marriage denied event to them and my husband). Windyridge referenced a different thread that mentioned hoping for death, but I can understand if someone is that badly off thinking it might be kinder for caregiver and patient.

My dad isn't a narcissist person, he's greatly loved, and I'm going to miss him beyond measure when he's gone. However, I fully get so many parts of this. It's miserable to see him so frustrated with his quality of life. He can't do much of anything that he used to enjoy. He's humiliated by the bladder and bowel accidents that are common, he walks with such effort even with a walker, and even with all the added attention he's crushingly lonely without my mom. He tells me almost daily that he's ready to die, and it's not depression, he's simply had enough. Yet he's on a boatload of meds that keep him here and he gets that same amazement by his docs at how "well" he's doing. What none of them see, despite my attempts at pointing it out, is the poor quality of life. They each only see things from the lens of their specialty, so the cardiologist doesn't care that he pees himself, the urologist doesn't care that he gets short of breathe trying to walk, the dermatologist doesn't care that his arthritis hurts so bad he doesn't feel like moving, etc. They only like seeing that the particular part of the puzzle that's theirs seems to be okay. And because he's lonely, he likes going to all these docs! And everyday I try somehow to make things better and never really feel like I do. I'm thankful for this group and others who get it.

Gershun, it is indeed sad how many caregivers are hoping for the end to come. But the reality for so many is an elder who is nasty, has a multitude of Heath problems, and then there are the elders who were horrible abusive parents and now expect the abused kids to sacrifice their lives to caregiving.

And of course some elders are "Easy Keepers" , sweet, loving and thankful for the care they receive. My folks are sweet people, quite stubborn, but all in all pleasant. However the quality of life is at about 1%. My poor mom can barely get through each painful day and has to watch my Dad with dementia fade away more each week. I don't wish for death but I sure hope they don't go another 10 years like this. I hope I've got ten years left for christs sake!

In fairness to the people who are still in the middle of the marathon, a race usually seems sweeter and more pleasant after it has been run.

Boy oh Boy, I totally get it! The race IS LONG!

I can relate to almost all that I've read here.

I love my mother, but resent the fact that she now resides with me. I feel doubly guilty because on balance I'm the angry one, not her. Yes, she's a narcissist, but one of the milder variety - not a screamer and yeller - more of a quietly manipulative one. I've only recently realized she's a narcissist because she was so stealth about it on so many levels over the years. I didn't realize till recently that the nasty, unfeeling comments she'd make to me on occasion, and her silence toward me when displeased was all narcissism. Yes, she did some emotional damage to me that I'm still figuring out and coming to terms with. Still, she wakes up happy every morning, and is a kind person and super easy to get along with. Seriously.

That's my double guilt - she's very pleasant to deal with and very unobtrusive and not demanding. I know there are folks on this site who would give anything to caregive for someone like her. I feel such guilt because as far as caregiving goes she IS basically very easy to deal with. She is 87 and has vascular dementia, had a few strokes, talks vegetable soup - to the extent that I can't tell when she's grounded in reality or sundowning. She's somewhat incontinent - we do have s**tsplosions on a regular basis - usually at night. She's lost weight - her normal weight is 116 - 120 lbs, but now she's down to 75 lbs. She's so frail! Cannot eat most foods as they give her diarrhea. Also when SHE gets mad, she refuses food (which she always does AFTER I've made the meal, never before).

Anyway, I'm an only child, single, and a loner. I'm used to living by myself and I love it. I do though have a wonderful boyfriend whose been through the worst of this with me and tells me he's in it with me for the long-haul - what a blessing he is! I just turned 60 last week.

I cannot put mom in a home - will not, actually - because aside from the fact that the nursing homes here in Florida are the absolute worst, she's a fall risk, and state law prohibits them being belted in or restrained for ANY reason (it would 'damage their self-esteem'). I know this because she had a 3 month stay in rehab for a fractured pelvis - the stay was so protracted because while there she was falling all the time and fractured on 3 separate occasions her left pelvis, right arm, and left shoulder. I will NOT place her because it would kill her in short order. AND as I'd said, the 'care' they're given is abominable anyway.

I'm lucky to have a great therapist, who says my anger is normal, and not to be so harsh on myself for my resentment, anger, etc., etc. he says I judge myself too harshly when I do get upset with her. I feel awful for not wanting my mother around and I feel awful for being angry with her for just being here and disrupting MY life. Oh, I almost forgot, I have a neuro-muscular condition that under the best of circumstances leaves me drained even on the best of days.

Can ANYONE relate? Thanks!
(PS...perhaps I should have started a new thread instead of posting this here....?)

Noor, your message fit right in here. We don't wish anything but good for them. But we also wish it for ourselves. The balance can get lopsided in caregiving. We can end up feeling so guilty for not being the best caregiver ever. Then we get messages of guilt from other people when we're not. Those messages weigh even heavier on us when we already feel guilt. Isn't it strange, because caregivers should be feeling useful and good about themselves instead of guilty about not being perfect.

My mom isn't a narcissist either, and on the whole she and I were always pretty good friends. Unfortunately the woman I thought I knew has physically become bottomless pit of need and mentally/emotionally become almost completely absent. She isn't mean and angry, I am, and I hate myself for it. Do I want her to die? ... no, but I can't understand what this half life is that we are both trapped in.

Hi JessieBelle - Thanks. Yes, lopsided it is indeed. You sound exactly like my therapist :) Funny thing is, when I sit down and take stock, I am proud of my care of her and all the things I do really well and work hard at concerning her care - I mean, I do a really good job and really do have her back. I just have to remember to take a step back and look at/remember that when guilt-tripping myself. My therapist is great, as far as he's concerned - when I talk about my guilt - his attitude is pretty much that anything I say/do short of stuffing her headfirst down an open manhole is A-okay. I need to remember that.

@CWillie - Purgatory is a name that works for me.

Noor, shouldn't laugh but Great mental image of "Stuffing headfirst down a manhole". We all need a yuk once in a while.

I'm sorry if I offended with my remarks. I know that not everyone had the sweet Mother that I had. I guess there are two ways of looking at this. Although I empathise with all of you who are having to deal with impossible to please parents, I don't get the way on other threads, maybe not this one, I hear people all the time almost making fun of their parents. I wonder why if these people hate their parents so much why they don't just stick them in a care home and forget about them. It's almost a form of martyrdom, isn't it? It's like a woman caring for the person who raped her. I understand that for some people it's too expensive to place their parent. I get that. But if a parent was so awful to you when you were growing up and you could afford to place them somewhere, why don't you?

It seems like an unhealthy type of co- dependancy to me. I'm sure some of you reading this are thinking "Oh, Gershun, what do you know" In fact someone on another thread said to me once. "Oh, easy for you to say Gershun, must be nice to have such a wonderful mother, but some of us weren't so lucky" Again, I get that. What I don't get is why you put yourself through it if there is an alternative.

I get that it's the Christian thing to do if you want to go there. But I never felt that God expected us to martyr ourselves. Trust me when I say if I had an abusive parent I would not put myself through what some of you are going through. In fact, I've made it clear to my husband from day one that if his mother ever moves in with us I will leave. She is the kind of manipulative person that you all describe and I can imagine what a nightmare taking care of her would be.

Anyhow, forgive the long post. I guess I am just trying to understand what makes you all tick, so to speak.

@Gershun - No offense taken. With relationships - as with life in general - things aren't always black and white - and the folks who do see things in b&w are usually the ones who fail to look too closely for fear of what they might see if they took the blinders off. From reading your post, it sounds like you tend to post a lot about your 'wonderful mother'. I find it interesting that writing about your 'wonderful mother' seems to be a theme...? Even others here have commented on it according to you. Here in a place where so many are conflicted about the feelings they have about taking care of an aging parent, spouse, sibling, grandparent...someone comes crowing about how wonderful their care taking experience is....BUT....that they're only posting such and such so they can "understand" what makes others here "tick"? Seriously? Sorry, but my gut says "doubtful". It feels as if you delight in sticking your fingers in others' eyes because watching them smart makes you feel superior...of course, all under the guise of helping them remove a cinder. Gershun - I only ask that if you ever bottle that rarefied air you breath to please be sure and pass it along to the rest of us.

Wow Noor, a little defensive aren't we? Why did you start your post with "No Offense taken" when obviously you are offended.

I think you would find if you bothered to read any of my many posts on AC that I am very sympathetic to others on here. Sticking my fingers in others eyes? What a bunch of B.S. You don't know the first thing about me my friend.

Gershun, truth is not always sweet. We can flavor it with words, but it doesn't change it. The original poster was being truthful. Her mother was alive but not living. Quality of life was zero, but she kept going because of medical intervention. Was the medical intervention the way to go? In this case the answer is apparently no. It created misery both for the mother and the caregiving child.

Truth can be shocking to read. Personally I felt for littleedie. You are right that she could place her mother in a nursing home, but someone somewhere is going to have to deal with this new truth. Perhaps it will get better.

Sorry you were shocked by the post. I don't know if you realize that you struck out at half the people in the group with your statement about writing about parents and martyrs. I hope this group does not become one where people feel unsafe to vent and talk truthfully about things. I know when things bother me here and I can't talk about it with anyone else that there are people here who will know. They are going through the same thing.

Jessie, I think those who have read me on here should know by now that I am not the type of person who would ever intentionally hurt someone with my remarks. I understand that Noor who doesn't know me might think that but I'm surprised that you would think that Jessie.

Intentionally, no. But you painted with a wide brush.

Okay I get it............my bad! I didn't personally insult you Jessie. Or Noor, or anyone else on here. I really was trying to understand what makes people tick whether Noor or you or anyone else on here wants to believe it or not. Did I phrase it wrong?Perhaps. Again I apologized........if you choose to not let it go. that's entirely up to you.

Just passing by, reading what everyone wrote.

littleeedie - Your thread has been somewhat hijacked. It happens.

People who have not experienced a narc parent have no idea what those of us who do, go through. It is sad. What we have and are going through is sad. I don't wish my mother to die, but I will experience some relief when she does and look forward to a release of the burden. I will also go through a normal grieving process.

I am interested in your view of "Leaving Home" and also your view of his views of Fairbairn's theory. I got a kindle version of Leaving Home and look forward to reading it.I don't know much about Fairbairn, but what little I have read gives hope than unearthing the pain in an atmosphere of compassion allows healing to take place. There is a lot of compassion for those with difficult/abusive parents on this site, but, there are some who do not have it.

Hope things are still reasonable for you. Holidays tend to be complicated times and with dysfunctional families, the dysfunctions tend to get amplified. ((((((((hugs))))))

Golden I have tons of compassion for people who had difficult/abusive parents and since all the criticism has been directed at me I can only assume your last remark was meant for me.

You know just cause I had a great Mom who I loved and who loved me does not mean that I do not understand hardship. In fact, in some ways watching her decline was even harder cause we had such a strong bond. So excuse me if I have not walked in your shoes, you people who have struggled so hard with Narc parents, but that does not mean that taking care of my Mom was a breeze.

I've had loads of antagonistic remarks thrown my way cause I didn't have a bad upbringing and I praise my Mom and adored her. It goes both ways, Golden, Jessie and whomever else on here wants to fling hurtful poo at me.

Get over yourselves. You haven't cornered the market on hurt and sadness.

Gershun - You make some very valid points. Why don't you start a thread on this? I am not criticizing. I can't share your experience and you cant share mine. If you were to write that I don't understand your experience I would agree with you, because I haven't lived it. In that sense, I cannot have the compassion for your experience as I can for someone whose experience I share. That's all I meant. I am not accusing you personally of not having any compassion.

I totally agree that we have not cornered the market on hurt and sadness. I didn't say we had. I was trying to get back to the theme of the original poster, as I am interested in the books she is reading.