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Leaders downgraded their duties to a wonton disregard for any persons or purposes that present a hardship or inconvenience within their individual immoral, amoral, or negligent mindsets. If they had worked to suppress the virus the way they have tried to suppress the vote far fewer would have died from COVID.
If they hadn't passed the buck from here to the other side of the world fewer would have died. This is our legacy that someone must rationalize to the next generation. What leaders today will accept the dirty work?


Likewise, once within our boundaries and in the air we breathed, we each owned the problem. Leaders refused to accept ownership of the crises. If the leaders embraced COVID the way they did their fake news, we would have had better compliance once restrictions were established.


The public's attitudes about COVID, I think, are a mirror of the disrespect we were shown from the start. Leaders and their staff got infected yet they still refused to acknowledge COVID. They encouraged people to continue doing as we wanted. A key concept I took away from this was "as we wanted". So there we go. We're all exonerated from exercising any responsibility for our own well-being or that of others. The leaders owe nothing to their constituents, so we owe nothing to ourselves or others.


Despite all of this and more, leaders flaunted their wonton disregard for the health and well-being of others. By extension, why should you or I wear a mask, maintain distance, clean up/sanitize or even get a vaccine?
Why should we care if we are rushed to the hospital, die, have long-haul after effects, or cause anyone else to die? Why should we care if we lose our jobs - or someone we know loses a job? Why should we care about dead bodies awaiting transport and cremation?
Leaders gave themselves free passes for life. This provides an out to the general population to not share in the responsibility by altering their own behavior.
No one could literally see what caused the COVID crises and that's a great excuse for leaders to say they didn't know. Well, the snow fell, the ice froze, the fires blazed, but the leaders needed a respite or needed to consult with victims. A "family" trip to a warmer place, and advice to another state to "rake it's forests". Leaders have that free pass to add insult to injury. What will youthful future leaders learn? To follow by example?
So, I think COVID has really exposed us not only to a deadly virus, but also to just how disrespectful society in general has become. The very young and the very old can't fend for themselves. It's difficult too for those in the middle who are trying their hardest to make it work out.

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You are entitled to believe as you wish. No one will force you to do otherwise. Some will agree with you. Others will not. Many won’t comment one way or the other.

Live according to your own convictions, while still being considerate of others. Change what you are able to. Accept what you can’t change. No one can solve all of the world’s problems. Tty to find peace in your heart.

I wouldn’t be overly concerned about others. Be more concerned with your own actions.
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NeedHelpWithMom, This question is the very reason that I never visit discussions anymore at all. Today I was in a great mood, so I thought "WOW, let me click on this and watch everyone bring out the snakes". These questions never educate, never make us think. They just get us angry and pushed further into our own corners.
But now, coming in to watch the dog fight, instead I get your level-headed and beautiful response to this question.
Like you, I don't much worry about others anymore. We all have to make our own decisions.
Thanks for making my day, NeedHelp. Perhaps some day, if your level head prevails, I will occ. come back to visit "discussions". I truly miss knowing what's going on with frequent posters, their families, their own trial in life, and so on. Just can't do the argument. Too old for it I guess.
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Canadian leaders on the whole have taken the pandemic very seriously, yet there have still been many deaths and many of us are currently experiencing another wave that is larger than the previous ones. Of course there are always people who point fingers saying that we weren't fast enough or strict enough, just as there are those on the opposite end of the spectrum who say we have gone too far and restrictions are causing more harm than good (and I'm not counting the loony-toon denyers). My point is that some things are beyond our control and even the best intentions are sometimes not enough, as far as I know the only place that managed to pull back from full scale spread has been China, and it took very extreme measures.

(I'll be unfollowing after this comment because like Alva I don't need the grief)
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Thanks, Alva. I truly feel this way. Is that a sign of me getting too old to care? Hee, hee. Or perhaps, I truly don’t care! 😊

I suspect it’s a bit of both. Like you, I find that feeling as I do about this type of posting is what brings me the most peace. Why put forth all that wasted time and energy on foolish arguments?

Some people enjoy that. If they do, let them knock their socks off without me.

Actually, I care deeply about particular issues, but I choose the people that I discuss certain topics with.
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Massive disrespect for others is not new.    Nor was it specifically conditioned on the breakout of Covid.    Fortunately or unfortunately, some leaders set standards, respectful or not.    That began well before the pandemic arrived and continues today.

I do agree with everyone who's posted so far that these kinds of very opinionated "discussions" spark responses that aren't helpful.   I understand that people have a need to express their thoughts, if not anger.   I think social media is a better forum for that; from what I've read, it's kind of like the Wild, Wild West.
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I thinking about what my parents and everyone else went through to help the community deal with World War II. I found a ration book that my parents had... imagine if every American was issued a series of ration books during this pandemic.

The ration books would contain removable stamps good for certain rationed items, like toilet paper, face masks, soap, hand sanitizers, etc. A person could not buy a rationed item without also giving the store the right ration stamp.

For me, I just look back into history and imagine if I had lived through those times. Chances are I would do the same as I am doing now. And I know not everyone would agree with me. Are people out only for themselves? Or out to help mankind?

I got my covid shots. I rather see that hospital bed not go to me but to someone else who is dealing with all the other health matters not related to covid.
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To all of you: I'm so sorry. Realize I've experienced my personal connections in these very areas mentioned, had to attend a couple funerals, watch the fallout of job loss, kids not being able to be in school as well the everyday things that all of us go through. The events and persons involved are sad for all of us. I thought, since so many of you have lots of experience maybe I could gain another perspective.
The only reason I haven't replied here is the first couple replies were saying they didn't think it was a good idea to say anything about this. I was respecting (or so I thought) your wishes to not discuss the COVID stuff. I have no intent and gain no satisfaction in fighting with or hurting anybody.
I do value your comments. If I've hurt you it's ok to say what you need to say. I put the question out there so must accept your answers without ill will.
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Houseplant, I think the possibility of the kinds of friction and disputes mentioned depend not only on the topic, but on the participating posters at the time.    There was one time some years ago when a poster with apparent mental instability challenged many, feuding, complaining, and more.     When those kinds of people aren't present, topics can be discussed more pleasantly.

But these are turbulent times, and some segments of society seem to be deliberately prolonging that.   And not everyone can step back and respond rationally, especially when topics are so intense.

I think your apology is so sincere that it's emotional.    What you're experiencing is legitimate and of concern to you, and that's one of the purposes of this forum, i.e., to share reactions to challenging situations.

I won't deny that it's hard to watch the news and not react strongly; I think that's part of the purpose, to generate and keep more viewers.    Sometimes we as individuals battle forces we don't really think about, but ones which create  a situation in which we respond w/o thinking.

You're very kind and generous to offer an apology; that speaks so highly of your analysis and recognition of the situation.
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The fact that you are still here is proof that whatever tried to beat you has lost.
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Well said!
What is so disturbing to me is the fact that this country calls self a Christian nation. Apparently, Christianity means total disregard for your fellow man, an eye for an eye, and intolerance for anyone different from you.
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FreqFlyer's comments about the challenges and stresses (and horrors) of WWII is a primary reason why I watch WWII movies and documentaries.   It's always a wake-up call as to how challenging, frightening and horrifying life could be.   And it puts in perspective how petty some contemporary complaints are, especially the ones that are garnering media attention now, and especially the shenanigans taking place in DC.
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I found this interesting:
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.history.com/.amp/news/1918-pandemic-spanish-flu-censorship
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Barb, that was a good if not unsettling article.   Thanks for sharing.
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Much less formal or informal censorship a century later.
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Just getting back online for a bit for a few moments. I like the jokes and comments here. The history link was quite interesting. There are so many ins/outs to all of it. There is usually an important story or event behind what's happening in the moment.
I treasure a hard-cover book given to me by a regular customer way back in my waitressing days. Classes and waiting on tables just seemed to take up all my time, so I wasn't asking for additional books to carry around. Some customers would "talk our ears off" - not a bad thing. One author/ customer gave me an autographed copy of his hard-cover book about his war experience.
About 10 years ago, a good friend of my dad who was also WW11 vintage had some paperback copies of his war diary and recollections. He took his documents to a small type & printshop and copies were made. I am so glad I got an autographed copy. Each book is about the same war but completely different realities of the war. One was from the air/technology, it's respective operators and their separations within. The other was a doctor on the Eastern Front who was captured and put into "medical duty" on the battlefields.

It's such a treasured book that each time anyone wanted to read it, I required they come to my kitchen table and not remove any book from my house.
I don't keep much stuff, including books, that required my actually packing into a box to move elsewhere. These experiences need to keep filtering through as the authors reported and intended.

I see today's younger group as the unsolicited journalists of today. Quite important given trends in censorship throughout all theses major, historical events, including the health and wellness of everybody. I've not talked with any who intend to fulfill an important role, but they are for the most part.

I also like the reminder about the old ration books for food, t.p. etc. This reminds me the S&H Green Stamps and the Blue Chip Stamps my parents used when we were young. Post WW11, but a jump from rations to actually saving to get something we wanted. Never thought of this - we've evolved from ration books to stamps to paper coupons and newspapers. Now we use coupons/offers from our computers or hand-held devices.
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