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My elderly uncle has fairly recently entered a nursing home as a permanent resident. He established a resident trust fund account there from which his monthly fee is withdrawn to pay for his care (he is self-pay for the time being). He was given his first quarterly print-out of the account's activity and noticed a withdraw for $3000 for "patient liability". He questioned this as he had no idea what it was about and finally got the scoop after what he considered some hemming and hawing: the business office manager withdrew the money to pay a company called Medicaid Done Well to submit paperwork to help my uncle get Medicaid when his personal funds run out. My uncle is well aware that his funds will not last forever and that eventually he will need to apply for Medicaid but he did not give permission for the BOM to withdraw the money to pay Medicaid Done Well for its services. He didn't even know such a company existed. My uncle was not too happy at first about this whole thing but has decided that he doesn't want to rock the boat. He is happy with the care in the nursing home; he really likes several of the caregivers, says the food is decent, and the big plus with this place is that is provides hemodialysis services in the building. The BOM told my uncle that what happened was a "misunderstanding" and that, since my uncle has to spend down his money anyway, the $3000 was a way to accomplish that goal (or something along those lines). But this whole thing makes me very uneasy. The nursing home administrator is aware of what transpired but I think that corporate office should be told (they own probably about a dozen nursing homes in the state). I'm no lawyer but I think something illegal took place and I also wonder if this could possibly be some kind of scheme between the nursing home and Medicaid Done Well. My sister wants to report it to the state's attorney general's office. But since our uncle wants to let it go, should we honor his wishes?

After reading your experience I’m even more grateful for the business office manager at my mother’s nursing home who walked our family through the Medicaid application process (when the money was running out) at no cost whatsoever and with expert knowledge. What a shame to be taken advantage of this way
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Reply to Daughterof1930
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Thanks for the replies. I'm going to visit my uncle at the nursing home in a day or two. I'll bring up the subject and see how he responds. I want to respect his position on this matter but I also don't want him to be taken advantage of. I also have concerns that maybe this is a pattern of behavior on the BOM's part and he is getting away with other unethical if not downright illegal things. I did an internet search of stealing from nursing home residents' trust accounts and came across an article from USA Today. Apparently it's fairly easy for certain nursing home personnel to take money from these accounts without the account owners' permission. I'm also going to confirm the name of the Medicaid application business. I did find a couple of things online about Medicaid Done Right and one of them was a lawsuit brought by the state of Tennessee for unsavory business practices (that's probably not the correct legal term). https://www.tn.gov/content/dam/tn/attorneygeneral/documents/pr/2020/pr20-29-complaint-afj.pdf
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AlvaDeer Jun 18, 2024
Thanks so much for this extra info.
You are very bright! Stick around. We need you here. This is great info.
And a warning to all to watch things and stay on the toes.
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Your uncle was deceived, the Social Worker at the facility is the one that applies for Medicaid if the resident or the resident's rep does not do this

No concern about "Rocking the boat", the BOM and probably the rest of the administration has little to no contact with residents unless it is a business matter or the state is there.

There is a company called Medicaid Done. Right which contracts with NHs for the Medicaid application; it has expanded to several states and NHs
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We cannot know the details of course and are getting this second hand from you who got it second hand from your uncle who got it from the business manager's office.

If all you indicate above is true I would be VERY VERY uncomfortable with this.
I would suggest to the POA Uncle that the two of you make an appointment with the ADMINISTRATOR in charge at this nursing home.

Reports of this done without signed permission would be very very concerning and could lose them their licensure in the state. This isn't good.

I myself would be tempted to pay to have this application work done, myself. But I would want to shop out the prices and choices and certainly wouldn't want it done over my head. OR under my hand!
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cover9339 Jun 17, 2024
LTC Medicaid was applied for and approved without my signed permission.
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An update: the nursing home administrator has apologized for an "egregious" misunderstanding that should not have happened and action has been taken for this not to happen again. The BOM contacted a MDR agent and told him that my uncle would be needing to apply for Medicaid in the not-too-distant future. Somewhere along the way, the MDR agent came under the impression that my uncle would be one of the "easy" applicants; i.e., someone for whom the nursing home would pay MDR's fee. My uncle does recall a young man coming to his room to talk to him about applying for Medicaid and signing some paperwork. However, my uncle thought he was talking to someone who worked at the nursing home. My uncle doesn't remember how the man introduced himself, but we don't believe anything shady was going on. This is where things get kind of muddled and I'm left not knowing if I should believe it or not but apparently, the BOM believed that my uncle signed the "correct" paperwork (agreeing to pay the $3000 fee) and that is why he withdrew the $3000 and gave it to MDR. According to the administrator, the MDR agent was at the nursing home that day to talk to several residents and got confused to as who was whom. All of this was attributed to very poor communication between the BOM and MDR agent as well as assumptions being made without proper verification. In my opinion, this all could be true but there is one element that still bugs me that I've decided to keep to myself: why was the payment to MDR listed as "patient liability" on the fund activity statement that my uncle received and not exactly what it was for and/or who it was paid to? Seems like poor bookkeeping at the very least. Anyway, my uncle is satisfied, and I guess I'm satisfied enough. Hopefully all involved learned a valuable lesson.
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You need to stop the NH from withdrawing from Uncles account. It should never have been done this way. Does he not have a POA? If not and he is competent, I would take on the assignment and set up a different acct. If he is competent, he should have signed for that withdrawl. I would also wonder if using this Company is mandated by Medicaid or a POA can apply. I did Moms. She was under both the asset and income caps. She had a home, that was exempt but being sold. She spent down what assets she had paying privately. I got info Medicaid needed and it was pretty cut and dried. Unless the Statevis Uncles Gaurdian and OKd this, IMO it should never have happened.
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LyndeeNew Jun 20, 2024
From what I found online about the company (most of the information coming from a lawsuit filed against them by the state of Tennessee), Medicaid Done Right "partners" with a nursing home (don't know if this partnering is a legally binding contract or something more informal) so that the nursing home will exclusively use MDR when a resident applies for Medicaid. If the application is an uncomplicated one, then the nursing home pays MDR a relatively small fee but if the application is more complex (the applicant has more assets to deal with) then the applicant pays the fee which is anywhere from $2000 to $4000 (I think the exact amount depends on the state the person resides in although I could not find explicit information to confirm this). Of course, the resident or the resident's power of attorney has to agree to use MDR and pay their fee. According to the Tennessee lawsuit, residents and POAs claimed that they were given the impression that they had no choice but to use MDR's services. Some people also complained that the nursing homes and MDR were not clear that MDR is a private business and as a result, some people thought they were talking with a caseworker from the state. MDR had to change its website, brochures, etc. as a result of the lawsuit. They had to let people know that they can get help from the state of Tennessee for free when applying for Medicaid and that using MDR's service is optional.
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This is all very valuable information. How truly sad, and despicable, that there are people and facilities who seem completely willing to victimize patients and their families at a very difficult time. With the insertion of private equity into long-term care, the "care" part has pretty much disappeared. It's ALL about the money. And I fully expect that it will get worse over the next 4 years.
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cover9339 Nov 19, 2024
You're probably right, sadly.
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I did a browser search but only a company called Medicaid Done Right comes up (a FL-based company).

Nothing at all under Medicaid Done Well. So, either your Uncle has the name wrong or it is a scam of sorts. $3K sounds steep. Is it possible he doesn't remember signing to do it? Are you getting all your info from him verbally and not in person yourself? Many elders with memory deficits get their info wrong.

Also:

https://www.agingcare.com/questions/shocker-of-a-phone-call-today-about-medicaid-application-and-her-stay-at-the-nh-how-does-this-happen-477565.htm

This OP mentions that Medicaid Done Right processed the applications at their LO's NH.
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I search the internet for “Medicaid Done Right nursing home” from time to time to see if anyone has had an experience like mine and my husband’s and this one comes close. Several years ago, my husband was admitted to a nursing home for rehab after a lengthy hospital admission. He was in his early 60s and still employed and his employer-sponsored medical insurance was covering his stay there as arranged by the hospital case manager. My husband was there for several weeks when we got word from the business office that my husband’s insurance had apparently been retroactively cancelled to the beginning of his stay. It turned out that my husband had been fired from his job. His employer had given him no notice of termination nor info on COBRA which they were required to do. But all that is a separate issue. As I was waiting for the COBRA paperwork to come in the mail and, quite frankly, trying to find my bearings, something happened which sent us down a path that we never should have gone down. I partially blame the nursing home and I partially blame myself for being so uninformed and naïve. But live and learn, right? I received a call from a man telling me that the nursing home had given him my number and that he was going to help my husband get Medicaid to cover his nursing home stay. I had heard of Medicaid before and understood what it was in a general way. The man said that he wanted to meet with both my husband and me at the nursing home in a few days and that I needed to bring certain documents like my husband’s SS card, driver’s license, income records, and bank statements. Unfortunately, my husband was readmitted to the hospital before the meeting could take place. The man arranged for just him and me to meet about a week later at a public place. I need to say at this point in the story, this man had never told me that he worked for a business called Medicaid Done Right. The nursing home referred to him as a “Medicaid agent” in several emails to me and never used the name Medicaid Done Right. I was under the impression that this man was a caseworker from the Department of Human Services from our state. I think the reason that I assumed this was because my husband, while not employed by the state, worked with state caseworkers to get people food benefits. I had been hearing about state caseworkers in the human services area for a long time. So, I met this man at a local food establishment as arranged and I gave him the documents that he had requested. I handed over copies of two bank account statements. Both accounts combined totaled over $60,000. I remember the man saying something like “Oh, I was told this was going to be easy” as he looked at the statements. I didn’t really know what that meant but I didn’t ask for clarification because he kind of said it under his breath and then quickly went on to another topic like it wasn’t all that important. When we got up to leave, the man said “Here, let me give you my card”. I took the card and read “Medicaid Done Right” printed in large letters. It suddenly dawned on me - this man is not from the state. But I didn’t say anything because I felt stupid. 

About a week and a half passes, my husband is still in the hospital, and I get a letter in the mail from the business office manager from the nursing home. It is addressed to my husband. It tells my husband that upon reviewing his account, it has been discovered that there is a past due balance of $3,000 and to please take care of that promptly. I found this very odd. “Past due” implies that payment had been asked for before and I knew that no such request had been received at our home. I called my husband at the hospital and he didn’t recall any request for $3,000 or any type of payment at all. Obviously, with his insurance being cancelled, payment was owed but any previous conversation had to do with getting his insurance reinstated via COBRA or now, apparently, Medicaid.

(continued in post #2)
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Wrenee5111 Oct 5, 2024
Post #2:

We had gotten advice from a knowledgeable person to request an itemized bill of this $3,000 charge in writing. What we received was pretty strange. The business office manager sent an itemized bill of EVERY charge, such as all my husband’s therapy sessions, days of room and board, and two separate charges labelled as “patient liability”, $1500 for January and $1500 for February (my husband had entered the facility mid-January and left for the hospital late February). In total, the charges were over $30,000.00.  This printout was several pages long and rather dense so it took me a while to see the two $1,500 charges but I figured that they add up to $3,000 so could that be it? But still, it didn’t answer the question “what is the $3,000 for”? Is it some kind of co-pay? My mind even considered if my husband had broken a piece of expensive equipment in the rehab room that he had to pay for on an installment plan. When I asked the NH administrator for an explanation of the $3,000 charge, she responded by telling me to ask the business office manager. Her response was not helpful at all obviously and I was becoming more convinced that something odd was going on here. Why could I not get an answer to a very simple question? I believe that I eventually found the answer but it took me many months. The answer did not come from the nursing home; they continued to be evasive all the way up to the corporate level. They couldn’t admit what the business office manager had done because it was most likely illegal. It was definitely unethical. This is what I believe happened because it is the only thing that makes sense. I have tried to break my hypothesis on this and it doesn’t break. The business office manager took it upon himself to pay, from the nursing home’s coffers, Medicaid Done Right’s $3,000 fee to process my husband’s application without my husband’s knowledge or consent. I think he did this because he wanted to get the ball rolling on the Medicaid application, but my husband wasn’t there to sign paperwork agreeing to pay MDR’s $3,000 fee for processing more complex applications. If you remember from earlier, everyone seemed to be working under the assumption that my husband’s case would be “easy”. Then the BOM had to recoup the $3000 because the nursing home isn’t the one who is supposed to pay this fee; the patient is. I have next to zero doubt that MDR was paid their fee, and it wasn’t my husband and me who paid it, so that only leaves the nursing home in my opinion. There was never any legitimate “patient liability” of $1500 for January and $1500 for February. That was a falsehood concocted to add the illegitimate $3000 charge to my husband’s account. I’ll go ahead and call it low-key money laundering if you all don’t mind. I believe that the business office manager thought I would question nothing; my husband was in the hospital quite ill (he had tested covid positive in the nursing home, was in quarantine for 10 days and seemed to have come out of it OK but then developed severe kidney dysfunction about a week later), and I wouldn’t want to burden him with this issue, I would just pay the $3000 and be done with it. And he knew without a doubt that I could pay it, no problem. How? Because he knew how much money we had in the bank. I know this because he told me. He phoned me a day or two after I had met with the MDR rep and said (paraphrasing) “your husband has almost $70,000 in the bank. He isn’t going to qualify for Medicaid”.  Unbeknownst to me, MDR gives all the financial info you give them to the nursing home. Or at least they did then. Not to be dramatic, but this made me feel a sense of violation. I think that if some third party is going to have access to the private information I give you, you should tell me beforehand. I was feeling antsy enough knowing that I had given my personal info (including my SSN) to someone whom I thought was from the state and turned out not to be. 

(continued in post #3)
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I hope OP gets uncles money back.
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