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A 5 year look back is just that......Medicaid is taking a look at what's transpired financially for the past 5 years. To see if large sums of money were given away as a gift or otherwise hidden in an effort to get Medicaid when it wasn't warranted. If they find such a thing took place, they can penalize the applicant by withholding benefits or the like, but they certainly will not take money from anyone's account because it does not belong to Medicaid. All they can do is withhold benefits.
Your profile says that your dad is in a nursing home. Why are you inquiring about this now? Are you concerned about your father not being able to stay in his facility? Did he give money away to your sibling?
Medicaid is state-specific and this is a global forum.
I don't think Medicaid can go in and claw-back people's money literally and directly especially if they're not the recipient, but it may mean that your parent will be denied.
If you're LO is having a problem or concerned about this, you should talk to an elder law attorney, an estate planner or a Medicaid Planner for your parent's state of residence.
Could you please provide details. I am not certain what you could possibly be talking about. Parents bank accounts should have nothing to do with the bank accounts of their children.
If the question is "do they investigate the accounts belonging to children of people who are applying for Medicaid" the answer is that they DO NOT. Siblings/children in the United States are no responsible to pay for care for their parents in any way. You may hear about "filial" law. But that is basically myth at this point in our country, and what laws are on the books are no implemented.
A five year lookback looks at your PARENT's expenditures. Now if those expenditures are money given to children/siblings of yours, those will be a problem. Not for the sibling, but for the parent, and may prevent that parent from qualifying.
If you can elaborate on your question a bit, give us details of what is concerning you, we may be able to help on a deeper level.
I have an elder law attorney in PA and she said my husband’s mother can gift him LEGALLY (he’s very disabled) only if I open up a separate checking account with me as the main person printed on checks as POA and his name is under mine. I also had to have a letter from his neurologist to keep on file in case she would ever end up in Skilled Nursing (she’s 100 and perfect health) and run out of money and have to apply for Medicaid. The Disabled Child law is for any “child” no matter what age to receive gifts from parents and that is exempt from 5 year lookback! I was shocked to learn of that. also, Medicaid sometimes tries to take you to court, but, as long as the doctor is on board and testifies (letter) that my husband needs care and she’s helping me it’s legal. Then, I can take money out of that account and pay for bills at home as he’s living here as if he were in a nursing facility. IF he would end up in Skilled Care, then I would close the account.
The five year look back only pertains to Dads finances. In most States 5 yrs of bank statements are required. Any accounts with his name on it are considered his unless proven otherwise. This is why we removed my 80 yr old mother's name from my disabled nephews acct. With the statements, they look for large amounts withdrawn or something out of the ordinary. They will require the reason for the withdrawals. Proof of IRAs, CDs, ect will be needed to.
You say sibling but this is your Dad? No sibling or child's finances will be looked at unless Dads name is on the accounts too. Meaning You may have co-mingled ur money. If these are your accounts Medicaid cannot touch them. From what I understand Medicaid can't go after family to help care for a LO.
The only way they can take money from a sibling’s account is if that sibling gives them permission to deduct money from his/her account. If your sibling does not want to be responsible for paying the bill, he/she should not sign any document giving them permission to do so.
They don't and can't grab money from people who received gifts from the Medicaid applicant UNLESS the Medicaid applicant is joint on the account. What happens is that Medicaid sees that the applicant gave big gifts to people during the five year lookback period. If they consider those amounts unreasonable, they will delay the start of Medicaid for as long as those amounts would have paid the applicant's bills. For most people, it's a delay before Medicaid starts (unless it was a lot of money). What often happens in families, unfortunately, is that one child has received a lot of money from the parent who is applying for Medicaid during the five year period. Usually, the child was having problems, so they no long have the money. Then the whole family has to figure out how to pay the parent's care bills until they qualify for Medicaid. Guess what? The child who received the money is seldom able to help with money, and they rarely volunteer as the caregiver. As parents age, they really need to think long and hard about handing out money, and the other kids should really speak up and point out what the parent may be doing to the other children. The parent will not be able to enter a facility unless someone pays. It's ugly to take money from an aged parent when they aren't wealthy. Really ugly.
They aren’t going to take money from anyone’s account, but whatever the gift was, it will be counted towards Medicaid during the five-year look back. Can’t hide it anywhere, nor should you try to.
"Claw Back" means they will retrieve the money in some way - but it doesn't mean they are going to go to the account of the person who received it and take it back out. That is reserved in situations for example after a person passes away and Social Security makes an additional payment to the deceased person's account - THEY will just retrieve their money.
Medicaid doesn't work that way. Each state has a Medicaid divisor. And in some states it even varies by facility. Essentially Medicaid basically will say "Ok so mom/dad gave Junior $X during the lookback period. We will use our nifty divisor to tell you how long mom/dad won't qualify for Medicaid to pay for their care and you can decide to either private pay for their care during that time, or you can take them out of the facility and provide care another way until they qualify for Medicaid"
So let's say that your state has a $5,000 a month divisor and they gave him $10,000 - then the "Divestment Penalty Period" would be 2 months during which they would NOT be eligible for Medicaid to pay for their long term care and either the family member would have to pay back that $10,000 towards their care OR they would have to be removed from care and be taken care of elsewhere until they qualify for Medicaid to pay for their LTC.
At least that is the way I understand it from the Medicaid website.
They may not take the moneyout of sibling's account, but they will count that money as an asset applicable to the look back period. Moving the money during lookback time does not hide it from being counted.
I think there is a lot of assumption here. The OP has not come back and given us more info. Why does OP feel that money will be deducted from his account? Did OP receive a large sum of money from parents that would effect them receiving Medicaid. If so, I don't think Medicaid will be able to touch OPs account because OP is not responsible for the cost parents care in a home. What will happen is a penalty will happen. So, someone pays for the parents stay in a NH until the penalty is satisfied or they take care of the parent until the penalty is satisfied.
I wish OP would come back and give us a clearer picture. For one, why does OP feel that Medicaid would have the ability to take money from their acct? Even if garnishing, it has to go thru legal channels that can be contested.
By proceeding, I agree that I understand the following disclosures:
I. How We Work in Washington.
Based on your preferences, we provide you with information about one or more of our contracted senior living providers ("Participating Communities") and provide your Senior Living Care Information to Participating Communities. The Participating Communities may contact you directly regarding their services.
APFM does not endorse or recommend any provider. It is your sole responsibility to select the appropriate care for yourself or your loved one. We work with both you and the Participating Communities in your search. We do not permit our Advisors to have an ownership interest in Participating Communities.
II. How We Are Paid.
We do not charge you any fee – we are paid by the Participating Communities. Some Participating Communities pay us a percentage of the first month's standard rate for the rent and care services you select. We invoice these fees after the senior moves in.
III. When We Tour.
APFM tours certain Participating Communities in Washington (typically more in metropolitan areas than in rural areas.) During the 12 month period prior to December 31, 2017, we toured 86.2% of Participating Communities with capacity for 20 or more residents.
IV. No Obligation or Commitment.
You have no obligation to use or to continue to use our services. Because you pay no fee to us, you will never need to ask for a refund.
V. Complaints.
Please contact our Family Feedback Line at (866) 584-7340 or ConsumerFeedback@aplaceformom.com to report any complaint. Consumers have many avenues to address a dispute with any referral service company, including the right to file a complaint with the Attorney General's office at: Consumer Protection Division, 800 5th Avenue, Ste. 2000, Seattle, 98104 or 800-551-4636.
VI. No Waiver of Your Rights.
APFM does not (and may not) require or even ask consumers seeking senior housing or care services in Washington State to sign waivers of liability for losses of personal property or injury or to sign waivers of any rights established under law.
I agree that:
A.
I authorize A Place For Mom ("APFM") to collect certain personal and contact detail information, as well as relevant health care information about me or from me about the senior family member or relative I am assisting ("Senior Living Care Information").
B.
APFM may provide information to me electronically. My electronic signature on agreements and documents has the same effect as if I signed them in ink.
C.
APFM may send all communications to me electronically via e-mail or by access to an APFM web site.
D.
If I want a paper copy, I can print a copy of the Disclosures or download the Disclosures for my records.
E.
This E-Sign Acknowledgement and Authorization applies to these Disclosures and all future Disclosures related to APFM's services, unless I revoke my authorization. You may revoke this authorization in writing at any time (except where we have already disclosed information before receiving your revocation.) This authorization will expire after one year.
F.
You consent to APFM's reaching out to you using a phone system than can auto-dial numbers (we miss rotary phones, too!), but this consent is not required to use our service.
I don't think Medicaid can go in and claw-back people's money literally and directly especially if they're not the recipient, but it may mean that your parent will be denied.
If you're LO is having a problem or concerned about this, you should talk to an elder law attorney, an estate planner or a Medicaid Planner for your parent's state of residence.
If the question is "do they investigate the accounts belonging to children of people who are applying for Medicaid" the answer is that they DO NOT. Siblings/children in the United States are no responsible to pay for care for their parents in any way. You may hear about "filial" law. But that is basically myth at this point in our country, and what laws are on the books are no implemented.
A five year lookback looks at your PARENT's expenditures. Now if those expenditures are money given to children/siblings of yours, those will be a problem. Not for the sibling, but for the parent, and may prevent that parent from qualifying.
If you can elaborate on your question a bit, give us details of what is concerning you, we may be able to help on a deeper level.
Wishing you the best.
also, Medicaid sometimes tries to take you to court, but, as long as the doctor is on board and testifies (letter) that my husband needs care and she’s helping me it’s legal.
Then, I can take money out of that account and pay for bills at home as he’s living here as if he were in a nursing facility. IF he would end up in Skilled Care, then I would close the account.
You say sibling but this is your Dad? No sibling or child's finances will be looked at unless Dads name is on the accounts too. Meaning You may have co-mingled ur money. If these are your accounts Medicaid cannot touch them. From what I understand Medicaid can't go after family to help care for a LO.
Medicaid doesn't work that way. Each state has a Medicaid divisor. And in some states it even varies by facility. Essentially Medicaid basically will say "Ok so mom/dad gave Junior $X during the lookback period. We will use our nifty divisor to tell you how long mom/dad won't qualify for Medicaid to pay for their care and you can decide to either private pay for their care during that time, or you can take them out of the facility and provide care another way until they qualify for Medicaid"
So let's say that your state has a $5,000 a month divisor and they gave him $10,000 - then the "Divestment Penalty Period" would be 2 months during which they would NOT be eligible for Medicaid to pay for their long term care and either the family member would have to pay back that $10,000 towards their care OR they would have to be removed from care and be taken care of elsewhere until they qualify for Medicaid to pay for their LTC.
At least that is the way I understand it from the Medicaid website.
Gena / Touch Matters