Has anyone had to tell their parent that they were filing for guardianship?

I’m not sure I understand your question. Is there some reason why dad can’t stay where he is? Will his life change that drastically simply because one of you will now have guardianship over him? He sounds very independent and probably doesn’t realize (and you probably shouldn’t mention it) that the people at his facility are doing things for him now and in effect being his guardians. In reality, can he actually get an attorney and take everyone to court, or is it just the rantings of a ticked off old man? So put that one aside.

You have done what needs to be done. It doesn’t sound like you’ve had an easy relationship with him over your lifetime. Old hurts and accusations rise to the surface during times like this. Hold your ground and consider the source.

From my experience with my parents, people with memory issues do not realize their level of cognitive impairment and people who have cognitive problems without a major memory impact deny them to others as a defense mechanism.

My mother's short term memory is bad while her cognitive abilities are only slightly impacted and she will asked me "Am I really that bad?" when I tell her we NEED to do something. She initially resisted using notes and labels to help her remember things, but eventually embraced them.

My father's memory was not much impacted (at least initially) by his multiple TIAs leading to vascular dementia, but his cognitive skills were clearly impacted. My father grew up in and worked in the construction industry his entire life. As a child I was his gofer while he remodeled an old house rental house - doing excellent quality masonry, carpentry, plumbing, electrical, and roofing (didn't realize that skill level that much at the time, but appreciated it more later as an adult). In his job, he directed architects and reviewed drawings and inspected buildings. As an adult I was helping him install a new dishwasher and realized he couldn't make a minor adjustment in the install to accommodate his drain line going into the wall instead of through the floor as shown in the diagram. I knew he had some deficits but until that moment didn't realize nearly how bad basic cognitive abilities had been impacted. Daddy continues to this day to claim he has no problems whatsoever. He knows that he does - some of the things he asked for my help with indicate he didn't always trust his own judgment in the mid dementia stage. Now he has advanced dementia, does no thinking for himself, follows the lead of a child that has isolated him from the rest of the family in a effort to protect an inheritance, and is very verbally abusive to nearly everyone who crosses his path.

Your father's rant is very similar to what we have experienced with my father anytime we tried to discuss his problems over the years and how we might mitigate or address some of the them. Chin up, if the medical evidence of incompetence is there, the court will establish a guardianship. My understanding is that if the children are united in who they want for conservator, the court will usually give that more weight that the incompetent elder who is angry that his competency is being challenged. Going outside the family for the conservator only becomes likely when the family is arguing or the assets to be managed are large or complex. Your father may eventually forget he has a conservator so I wouldn't discuss it again unless he brings it up.

I sense animosity toward this 90 year old and I hope that is not the future guardian. Forgiveness is good for the soul. You started out asking about the guardianship and his abandonment and drama and chaos issues seemed to over power your concern of the guardianship. Maybe one of his sisters is best to be the guardianship. If I offended someone in my life, that is the last person I want to have guardianship over me.

In our relationship my mother in law is very angry that my son is now her agent/guardian. Each day is a fight and a battle of sorts. Lots of calls from my sister in law to tell me what to do.
So the anger part seems pretty normal, that is what we are finding out.
Guardianship is not all it is cracked up to be as a family member.

Is he going to stay in Long Term Care or are you wanting him to move?

It would be WW3 if someone got guardianship over my mother (unless she was really out of it). It won't be me. It will be one of the Golden Boy brothers. I will make sure of THAT!

prairie, it sounds to me like you just go about it and sidestep the comments best you can. It was a necessary legal action and one that he’s lucky you all are taking. It IS sad! It sounds like you and your siblings are on the same page overall, and that is a blessing. Hang in there, let him bluster about all the things he’s going to do. 

Over the years (I’m early 50s, Mom is late 80s - single parent, I’m an only child) her anger fits at me feel somehow related to guilt... like she’s afraid how I treat her will mirror how she treated me as a child (or worse, how her family treated her - any childhood trauma in your dad’s past?). So that’s just an idea to work with. It sounds like there’s always fear and suspicion once folks get old, very sad indeed.  Keep up the good fight. :)

I have legal guardianship of both my parents. They were very angry with me and managed to get a court appointed attorney. Their attorney understood that both of them were in need of someone to manage their affairs, so he negotiated with me on what they could and couldn't have when they moved to assisted living.
My Dad was so angry with me that he told me if he had a gun, he would put it to the back of my head and pull the trigger. That was two years ago. Now, they are both in a safe environment and seem to have forgotten about the whole thing.
It isn't easy going through the process, but it's well worth it.

Ahmijoy stated it all very well.

I didn't want guardianship over my dad. I didn't want POA for him - heck, some days I have enough trouble attending my own problems. I was glad to assist him and he often apologized for not naming me POA but I just reminded him that I never asked for it. It was always someone else suggesting it to him. 7.5 years later I helped him to get into Hospice and they made his last week on earth total bliss.

Your father does sound like he is functioning - why would you think the state is going to step in and appoint a guardian??

Something is missing in your question, but the state doesn't just step in and appoint guardians for the elderly. Not without a valid reason. If you have papers telling you that the state will step in, then it really doesn't matter what Dad says.

Why did you feel the need to tell him? What caused this need to arise? You don't have to state it here - but maybe you need an attorney - an Elder Attorney?

If family is willing to take on the Power of Attorney that is usually the better way to go; however, there are so many dynamics in family relationships these days, that a family member isn't always the best choice. If parents are wise in their cognitive (earlier) years, they will observe their own children, and even discuss with them their desires to place one or more children as their POA. My parents chose me and talked with me. When my mom was beginning to show some more serious health issues (later learned she had Parkinson's and had experienced some TIA's), my parents and I sat down with their lawyer to discuss what my role would be. This was helpful, but I have to admit nothing can prepare anyone for what POA will require of them. Thankfully, God gave my parents wisdom to see which child would best look out for their best interests. They trained all of us well during our childhood, but the skills I was blessed with and the determination to always care most about their needs must have been something they saw in me over the years. It was never easy, but I'm so glad they planned ahead and we worked together. They are both in glory now, and I can honestly say that every decision (which wasn't necessarily the one's my siblings would have made) were the best ones for my parents. I had great counsel when I struggled, and I often prayed for wisdom—which God promises to give His children.

Now, my husband and are trying to help my aunt and uncle. Their sons do not want the responsibility of caring for their parents. My uncle was and still is verbally abusive toward them (and sometimes toward us, just not as forceful). My uncle's V.A. doctor (and possibly others) have reported to Social Services, my uncle's inability to care properly for my aunt, and even for himself. So now the court is working to appoint a guardian for both of them and possibly have them moved out of their home into a facility. My uncle is adamant that he has no dementia, but wow! does he ever! Not only dementia (that doctors have documented), but also paranoia, etc. He spends nearly all day on the phone calling bill collectors and banks to argue over his bills and to say that it's all fraud. He forgets when accounts have been closed due to negative balances, and often calls us in a panic because he "just learned that 'those people' have closed his account!" We can remind him daily about the lack of money in the account, but he will forget. Meals are a thing that happens when he thinks about it (last night neither of them had eaten dinner, and he was still talking to my husband on the phone at 9:50 p.m.) At least Meals on Wheels brings lunch M-F!

I say all this, because having a court appointed guardian that is not a family member is a long process, so one has to be prepared for this. If you have a sibling that is trustworthy and capable of determining what is best for your dad, then by all means allow them to become his guardian. If not, then a court appointed guardian may be better.

None of this is easy, and family dynamics when abuse has been a part of the mix is even worse as a person ages. I will pray for your family and for wisdom and encouragement as all of you walk this path. At least your dad sounds like he's getting good care, has a roof over his head, and is being fed daily on a schedule—all of that is a good thing!

I would not jump to guardianship if I were you. You could end up getting a court appointed guardian and unfortunately they are not all honest pious people. Read the book Guardianship Fraud by M Larsen before you do anything...educate yourself before you bring the courts (and expensive attorneys) into your lives.

I too was advised against guardianship. Turns out you really have to keep detailed records, and protect yourself against any future liabilities. The court will request that you take inventory of the assets in the home, and you will have to regularly report to the court on finances.

Without guardianship however, you don't need to worry about these details so much.

The other issue is that they can contest the guardianship, the court will appoint a lawyer to represent them, and should you lose your case, you will be responsible for costs.

I still do not have a POA for my Mom, but she's in a home and at the end of the day everything is working out fine. When my Dad was in his final days at the hospital, they accepted a DNR from me with no documentation. It was a very hard document to sign, but he had been going downhill rapidly. They kept him as comfortable as they could until the end.

I'm sure that some people have done fine with POA but it's been mine and my siblings' experience that even with a well-documented guardianship, we've had MANY problems with doctors and social workers refusing to report to us or work with us without a hard copy of the guardianship agreement in their hands. I think this is because our mother is adamant that there's nothing wrong with her cognition. She's just well functioning enough that once she goes into a rant to the doctor or social worker about how we're out to control her, some people find this convincing. If your father is angry and likely to try to persuade people to not work with you, I'd recommend filing for guardianship.

I've been almost where you're at. My siblings and I filed for guardianship when our mother started deteriorating suddenly after our father died 5 years ago. She was not even 65 at the time but was acting like someone elderly, showing signs of dementia, calling 911 frequently etc. for ambiguous symptoms. She was eventually diagnosed with mild vascular dementia (which she continues to deny is true) and with hypomagnasemia (ditto). She was furious with my siblings and me when we filed for guardianship and continues to be passive-aggressive about it, insisting that we're just trying to control her when the reality is we wish she was fully capable of living on her own and that we didn't have to intervene at all. Because we had guardianship, we were able to make sure that she underwent a rehabilitation therapy course in a nursing home for 90 days that significantly improved her cognitive function and then she was released to live on her own again. She does mostly ok. But she recently had a stroke, and we were grateful that we'd filed for guardianship because it enabled us to interact with the doctors on her behalf. She's back at home now after the stroke and continues to deny that she's incapacitated in any way; but at least with the guardianship, if we're concerned, we can intervene. You're doing the right thing, despite your father's reactions. I don't know about the laws in your state, but if it's like Utah, the court will appoint a lawyer to represent him in the proceedings so that the state can assure that he's not being taken advantage of. You'll then have to file yearly paperwork to give the state his status update, and report on his financial estate. It's a lot of work to do on behalf of someone who resents it and accuses you of trying to control their life, I know from personal experience. It is a strange thing to find yourself the guardian of a parent who wasn't the fully nurturing parent they could have been to you when you were a child. If it helps, I can say that I understand and empathize.

Good morning to everyone.
I'm basically going through this with my Mom right now. When I say basically, I mean I'm only half of what you're going through.
I have 3 siblings, 2 back home and 1 out of State as I am too.
We have a melded family (you may love them, but beware too as I have learned in the past month+) which actually necessitated my having to file for both guardianship and conservator when I went back home, had a head-butt with 1 step-sibling as we were to be working as a team....wasn't working out at all as I'm a protector, she a spender of other's money!
Mom played her last hand by having to go to the hospital again via EMT-911 call. Neither the her Dr, hospital nor EMTs would allow her to come back to her home...too many 911 calls of which I never knew.
After 3 yrs of trying to help and being rebuked, my siblings decided that I should have been involved from the start...amazing how people have epiphanies at convenient times.
I was forced to place both parents in assisted living group home, cost is less than "normal" nursing home, BUT do your homework!
Due to MANY circumstances created by the step-sibling(s), I was also forced to file for my duty to our Mom to protect her sole and separate assets! My siblings agreed to this very quickly I must say!
As my position having been relegated to do (without any issue on my part), I did not "have to tell" Mom. This is the part where one really needs to research/ask professionals within the areas of State Laws, what is required of YOU, Court process and who MUST be involved once you do have your hearing!
IF your Father's doctor has stated/shows medical documentation indicating tests etc so as to be able to state your Father is not mentally, financially and physically able to care by himself, willing to state his condition(s) in writing to you; no in most States, you do not "have" to tell your parent(s). RESEARCH YOUR STATE'S REQUIREMENTS!
I had to file the Court last week and will have my hearing in 2-3 weeks as my attorney/paralegal had expedited my request due to some financial issues created by step-sibling(s) that actually fall under Elder Abuse in the past month; another topic for another time, but just keep that in mind too!
I just finished the on-line modules required by the Court and my certification as required by the State Supreme Court; who knew one had to do this!
I had already started 99% of what is required without knowing exactly what you MUST do; I think I did this because of my many years in banking.
Once you understand what you're stepping into, YOU will have 2nd thoughts about YOUR ability to take on:
CONSERVATOR/GUARDIANSHIP
PERSONAL REPRESENTATIVE
ACCEPTED REPRESENTATIVE once your parent(s) have gone to greener pastures.
It is very intimidating to say the least.
So with that being said; if you have the diagnosis (you will be required to prove your case as well as your Father being represented by a Fiduciary in most cases), it isn't necessary to tell him. You have experienced his emotional roller coaster, so why make it harder for him? Do what is necessary FOR HIM, not for you. Once you know exactly what is required to perform this duty, all of you may decide it's easier as well as the cost to have the Court appoint a guardian; just stay in their business so you know they're doing their job!
The less, like my Mom who has Alzheimer's 3 due to diabetes, he knows the better off everyone will be. Mom now thinks she's at home and makes new friends everyday, even though they are the same 8 people and staff😁. You're going to stress more about what will be required of you while Dad becomes happier in the years he has left.
This step will get harder before it gets better no matter what others tell you. I did not let Mom see me when I had to sign the hospital release forms, went to the group home where my step-father was placed at the same time last week so I could drop things off for Mom/regarding Mom, left before she arrived via transport services (similar to EMT transport) WITHOUT TELLING HER I LOVE HER.
THAT is what hurts me the most right now. Why did I do things this way? I didn't want to add more to her plate with this transition and what will be happening very soon.

Only do what is necessary to protect your Father, even if that protection is due to other family members. TRUST me on this one! DON'T add to Dad's plate, you'll have a much bigger one.

The only thing about what I was going through, as well as my husband, was telling Mom she had 2 choices because she was going to the hospital with the EMTs.
I was going to get the belt used to help her pull her up in case she fell or just could not get up.
1. She'd let me place the belt around her to help the EMTs
2. I was going to spank her with it
With a little fight to get it around her and her elbowing me in the neck, telling her to keep hitting me if she wanted, her telling me to go back to bed, the EMTs laughing about spanking her...we all got her to the hospital.
The fun part but sad too, was turning the page on her at that moment. She had now become the child and I the Mom.

She said "us kids" filed for guardianship. So I am assuming she means her and siblings. Why would a court inform a dementia patient that someone is filing for guardianship. THEY HAVE DEMENTIA!

I wouldn't have told him. He is in a facility that evaluated him and feels he needs to be there. Your guardianship just gives you the power to over see his needs and make the decisions that he is no longer able to do.

Glad he seems to be doing well. You have and are doing what you can for a man who chose not to be in ur lives. He should be glad someone had some compassion.

I see that you care for a husband. Now you can put your energy to caring for him. Dad is safe, fed and clean. The home can become his payee for SS and pension if he has one. His laundry can be done there. All his needs will be met. You visit when and if u want. Enjoy!

PrairieLake, when I petitioned for guardianship of my dad a couple of years after I moved him to Idaho, the court appointed an attorney for him who met with him along with me and my attorney. My dad did not understand anything that was happening, but he enjoyed meeting and talking with everyone. When the court-appointed "visitor" (investigator) met with him, he again enjoyed the visit and the attention. I don't actually recall if I ever privately told my dad what I was doing, but I know I didn't try to explain any details. Obviously, my experience was easier than yours is going to be.

Given your dad's mental state, I think it is wise to seek guardianship for him. It seems unlikely he would sign any POA and, even if he did or even if you already have one, guardianship provides more assurance of authority than does POA. In my experience with three different guardianships, I (and my wife) haven't found the necessary record-keeping and court-reporting to be overly burdensome, but it does help to keep track of things as they occur and not wait to rely on memory when an annual report is about due.

In one of your prior posts, you said your four siblings live near your dad and you live in another state. Does your petition seek a single guardian or co-guardians? While it works well for my wife and me and and two daughters to be equal co-guardians of our youngest daughter, it probably would be a disaster for some of my siblings to be co-guardians with me for our dad. (Some of us had been his equal POA agents and that resulted in many problems, thus my guardianship.) My wife experienced trying to take care of her out-of-town aunt, both while a volunteer guardianship organization was her guardian and, later, when she and her sister became co-guardians due to the discomfort of the volunteer guardian not communicating well -- while she found it less stressful to be co-guardian than to be just an out-of-town caregiver with limited authority, being out-of-town did add a little stress to her guardianship responsibility.

My dad gave guardianship to my younger brother along with POA 10 years ago and today after dad has passed away and Mom is in Mental care, my older brother and I are having to fight this guy for spending all their money about half on himself. He quit paying her bills 6 months ago so APS had to get involved, which basically just scolded him. We are now trying to get her on medicaid, which is impossible without POA or guardianship, so make sure the one getting guardianship is honest to most degrees. Now we are having to deal with attorneys and it is just a mess if you don't plan it right. (my dad didn't plan it right)

Guardianship is often involuntary and there are valud reasons for seeking this. POA/Durable Medical POA is often insufficient in situations where a person is truly incompetent and needs to be legally protected from persons who might defraud them or where physical custody is not voluntary.
POA has limits. Guardianship has many fewer. It is a significant step, and stripping an adult of many rights of self determination, the right to sell property, to buy property in their name, to vote, refuse medical treatment etc. is at stake. Usually, a publicly sponsored ad litem attorney is automatically appointed to protect the person who is the subject of the guardianship petition. Only one person will actually become the guardian, and that person becomes PERSONALLY, LEGALLY and FINANCIALLY RESPONSIBLE for that person...A guardian can be sued . Just like the parents of a child can be sued, for the actions of the child.
Conservatorship is primarily financial in nature.

Both have significant fiduciary responsibilities that include annual reports to the court (which must be paid for out of the person’s estate, or by the Guardian/Conservator). Salary abd or reimbursements must be approved by the court, either in advance. An sale of real property or a significant asset must iften be approved in advance...another trip to court. Get ready for the legal fees.

I estimate we spent over $10k in 5 years. Out of our pocket, caring for my MIL. We had to pursue guardianship to prevent a fraudulent marriage and be able to physically control where she lived, legally. The man who was trying to marry her was seeking to sell her paid off home, and then attempt to secure half of the funds.

commutergirl,
"He was a selfish man, deserted and abandoned his children after our mothers died, caused drama and chaos for all of his 90 years."

Apparently you missed this part of PrairieLake's story. You need to read between those 2 lines of the full story for this person and the siblings. This man didn't "offend" his children, he disrupted and created a chaotic mess. It wasn't an acquaintance that did this that you can forgive and forget. It was their father! Imagine the pain they all suffered because of him. Empathy, commuter girl, empathy.... try walking in someone's shoes before becoming judge and jury and telling someone else how they should behave.

JoAnne29...yes, there are stages that a person is at with the illness and the person MUST be informed. They don't lose their rights until the Court decides they are too far into the illness. EVEN when a doctor gives the diagnosis, rights don't stop either.
Depending on what you are filing to become, the person will be represented by a Fiduciary. Some States, if the person has a lucid moment while being questioned OR if family objects, can provide a basis for contesting; you can be denied.
Each area of estate care has rules/laws that must be followed.
Guardian is different than Conservator which is different than a personal representative which is different from an accepted personal representative.
If you think filling out tax forms are difficult, that doesn't compare to the paperwork that MUST be done for any of these positions as well as having to report to the Court every year and budgeting the Estate.
I will know Monday or Tuesday when I have to appear for my hearing to become Mom's Guardian/conservator. In AZ, you must take on-line classes or modules per the State Supreme Court before you can file, provide your certification and be able to explain your responsibilities. The doctor who diagnosed Mom has Court papers to explain how he determined and what stage Mom is at right now. Mom will also be represented by a Fiduciary even though she won't be in Court.
There are other factors as to priorities to determine who will be appointed.
The main thread in their rights are not lost until the Court determines; then they become a minor once again...that's when their rights no longer exist.