I'm younger, recently married and one of more than a few siblings. My father passed away unexpectedly and my mother has moved back to our home state. She lived with us for several months and wasn't the easiest to live with (demanding attention at all hours, expecting our lives to stop...which it did...etc.). Of course we were empathetic and tried our best although this was mostly on my husband and I 24/7. Prior to my father's death, we planned to possibly buy a home together with them. After experiencing the new dynamic with my mom we quickly realized how unhealthy it would be due to a lack of boundaries and respect.
Fast forward to early Fall, she moved out to her own place a few minutes away from us. She insists on seeing us multiple times a week or dropping by to drop off random things, needing help etc. My issue is she does not put this stress or responsibility on my older siblings who live equidistant and who also do not have children. Because my work schedule isn't exactly consistent I am constantly being asked my work hours, what I am doing/ what my husband is doing (she texts him at work) etc.
When addressed about this unrelenting behavior, she acted confused and said "there's nothing wrong with or terrible if your family asks for a little help...". But it is every week and every weekend. To note, we don't have the strongest or healthiest of mother-daughter relationships. She really doesn't have a "true" or honest relationship with any of her children, unbeknownst to her it seems. She's very controlling and condescending even when we had her live with us. The kicker is that she conveniently is in the mental health field (retired).
Some examples of her typical behavior:
-When living with us, would tell me "you don't know what your husband and I talked about"
-You need to stop doing x,y, and z and save for a house (we already have one but she wants us to purchase a bigger one to accommodate her).
-Wouldn't let us (me and husband) grieve my father. Would get jealous if my siblings and I would bring him up in any positive capacity. It was so unhealthy having her here because we could not properly grieve due to her being so demanding and on top of us (as she still is to a slightly lesser degree). She still continues to behave this way.
-She also controlled the information about my father's status when he was unexpectedly sick (and dying) in the hospital (sounds crazy) until we were able to fly to them. She often wouldn't answer a text for hours so I would have my other sibling, who my mom is receptive to/respects, ask her.
-She asked for help (always last minute, constantly jumping for her) this weekend to drive her to see family in a different state and put things in storage, and stated how we saw friends last weekend. Was totally unreceptive to the idea we had stuff to get done this weekend as my husband works a lot and I am working the next few weekends. I’m always over explaining and reiterating as to why we can’t help on days when we honestly can’t. The only acceptable answer for her for me not to be able to help is when I’m actively working.
My question is how do I establish and reinforce healthy boundaries when she refuses to place responsibility on my other siblings? We are trying to start our life/ marriage and I feel like my life is regressing with how she’s behaving including her expectations. There is a level of guilt involved due to her being a widow and the fact that I had an amazing relationship with my father and would want to do right by him (even though she acted the same way toward him --berating, condescending, demanding). To note, she is physically and mentally healthy and in her early 70s. In all honesty, I am concerned she wants to disrupt my marriage as she does not like being alone. She is not receptive to any level of emotion or viewpoint— we have all tried.
I would start by not answering the phone every time she calls, and just let them go to your voicemail. And don't respond to her texts in a timely manner either. Get to them if and when you feel like it.
And it's probably time to have a "come to Jesus" meeting with her as well, laying out the new ground rules as to how often you will be available to "help" her and see her(like once every other week)and the fact that she will not be living with you in the future and if she's needing more care or wants more human interaction, she can start looking into an assisted living facility. There she will be around lots of folks her age and can start her new life over without being such a pain in the ass to you.
She's very young to be so needy(so quit enabling her)and it's time she moves on with her life without her husband and creates a new life for herself.
She can do it. You may just have to be like the mother bird who eventually has to push her babies out of the nest to let them learn to fly.
You will feel guilty because yiu dontvwant to hurt moms feelings or upset her but as you start setting boundaries the guilt should lessen over time. You don't have to jump when she calls.
Tell her she needs to call before coming over. If she ignores this do not answer the door. Its not your job to entertain her every weekend.
Nor do you have to give her your work schedule.
Be as up front with her as you want or lie by omission. Whatever makes it easier for you to deal with her.
Good luck.
"When u say NO, you are not responsible for the reaction you get."
Are you the more compassionate than ur other siblings? Have they set boundries? Are you the child that tried a little harder for her love? Easier to guilt? If so thats why she singles you out. You can be manipulated. You have to show her your not. Sit down with her and tell her. "Mom you have other children. I cannot be and won't be the one that you always go to." Explain that you are now married. Your DH is #1. You work odd hours. The in between time is for your DH and keeping house, doing errands taking trips. There will be no stopping by, she must call before. The constant calls and texts have to stop. No calls or text during work. (Me, if u text means not important so can get back to u when I can) You need to make her realize your life is not hers.
Your profile says she is in Independent living. If so, they have activities, entertainment and bussing for shopping and appts. Tell her to take advantage of them. Get to know people her own age. Make her realize you are not at her beck and call. You are not her entertainment or her Chauffeur. If she wants to see relatives, then she will need to find away. When she mentions you doing things and not saving for a bigger home, say that really isn't her concern how you spend your money and you are quite satisfied with the home you have. If she brings up living with you at some point in her life, tell her "Sorry Mom, but I found out when you were living here, that would never work out now. You will need to make other plans if your care goes beyond independent living." Yes, she will either get mad or cry but you need to be upfront and direct with these types of personality.
There's another thread going where the mother was a mental heath pro. She too lost her husband and she went down hill in her late 60s. Sounds like u two OPs have a lot in common.
No is a one word sentence
My Mantra...I am her to help people find the way, not be the way.
P.S. If Mom is in an Independent living complex, maybe get something from the office showing what services they provide to residents. Mom must still drive. Is she expecting you to do things she can do for herself. If so, by doing them for her your not just enabling her, your disabling her. She needs to be as independent and active as possible. If you continue to be at her beck and call, you will create a monster who will expect more and more as she ages. My MIL chose to move 900 miles away at the age of 68. My FIL died 3 yrs later. She lived alone the next 20 yrs by choice. Which was good, she had to take care of herself. What she couldn't do she had to hire someone. If she had stayed here, she would have relied on my DH. He would have done because he had the time. And she would have found out, I and his girls came first. She passed at 91.
Time to gather your courage. It is never too late to learn to open your mouth and speak your truth. Will she rage, argue, be angry, accusatory? Sure she will. Show her THIS thread and tell her I am predicting that. As a student of the mind she's learned all the tricks and they work for her.
The rules need to be set in writing. A. M. check in call and P.M. check in call if she truly needs that (truth is she has access to the same 911 number you have.) A few calls a week when you BOTH have time. Perhaps one meal a week. One week SHE cooks and you visit her and one YOU cook and she visits you and the visits last only so long as they are mutually pleasant
I so agree you need to read the Mr. Cloud's book. It's simple, fun and full of anecdotes. You will see Mom and see yourself in it.
This is on you. You and hubby need to sit and get straight what you are going to say.
When your Mother says to you "there's nothing wrong with asking for a little help" tell her "And there's nothing wrong with saying no".
She's a game player. She's done it for years, so she is good at it. She isn't in charge of who you grieve for and when you grieve; you are.
Guilt? You're kidding right? Guilt because she's a widow means you must have KILLED DAD. Guilt infers that you are an evil doer. I think not. How about changing out the g-word for grief. Grief that your Mom is trying to take over your life.
You need to set up boundaries. I loved my brother more than just about anyone in the world but he had a habit of up and out early with friends and why not stop by my house. I finally told him that if he did it again I would leave him out there ringing the bell.
You get to decide for your life. She needs to GET a life, now that she is alone, and still has this much energy.
If this were a girlfriend you would have long ago left her in the dust. Because this is a Mom she gets to stay. ON A LIMITED BASIS.
IF you show this to Mom you can let her know we are responding to your side. She must have a side, as well. Suggest she take up some hours of her life helping people. Tell her to join Forum and get a good addiction going.
It's game-playing. Manipulative and abusive games to become the center of the OP and her husband's lives.
The games stop when no one is willing to play.
That's a splendid idea about the mother joining this forum. She really should.
She is trying to turn the lives of you and your husband into what she wants them to be. She wants to be the center of your marriage and home by pitting you and your husband against each other. You don't know what she talks about with your husband? What a crock of BS. My mother tried to pull this as well. To pit both my husbands against me so she's be in control of our lives. It didn't work and I'm sure it didn't work in your case either. You get into bed every night with your husband. There's no secrets or private conversations between him and mom that you don't know about. He should have told her that. You should have too. Both my husbands had to tell my mother that.
You are correct in thinking she wants to disrupt your marriage. Your father was the person she berated, made demands on, was condescending to and if I may speak honestly, the person she took her abuse out on.
Now he is gone so she needs a new target to control and abuse. The new target is YOU.
Letting your mother lash out at you and behave abusively is in no way honoring the father you loved. The father who loved you would not see his daughter being treated like this. He would not see you suffering.
You and your husband have to stand united in creating boundaries with your mother and sticking to them.
BOTH of you need to make youselves plain in explaining. For example:
-She is not to come to your house unless you invite her or she calls first and asks permission to come by. If you say no, then no means no.
-She is not to call your husband at work for ANY reason. If there is an emergency of some kind she can call you or any of her other kids.
-You AND your husband make a schedule of the days you can go over her house. Then give this to her. If she cannot respect it, then both of you stop going to her house. She'll survive because she'll call one of your siblings. She will likely villify you and your husband at this point because you stop tolerating her behavior. Your siblings will understand if they become the new target or her abusive neediness.
She was jealous that you all loved your father and she wasn't the center of attention. Don't make her the center of attention in your lives now. She certainly wants to control your lives through abusive neediness and by manipulative games.
You have a right to grieve the father you loved. Your life is not going to revolve around the abusive neediness of your narcissistic mother.
My mother is similar. There was a time when I was easily manipulated by her games and abusive behavior.
Until I wasn't.
My husbands helped me learn about setting boundaries with her.
You must do the same.
Don't tolerate her controlling, abusive neediness, and games for one more day.
If your mom has always been like this, you might want to read up on Borderline Personality Disorder and see if it sounds familiar. Grief from the loss of a spouse doesn’t seem to explain her behavior.
You are an adult it is none of her business. "No" is a complete sentence might be time to start using that little word without explanation.
She is manipulating you, she could live another 20 years is this how you want to spend the best years of your life... being her puppet on a string?
My mother will turn 98 in February, I do not let her control me, my life.
Do what the other siblings are doing, back away and start getting control of your life.
You can turn off your phone. Or use the "do not disturb"
Your husband can do the same thing. Particularly at work. If she calls...voice mail. If she texts ..if he wants he can answer on a lunch break or when he gets home. (after dinner)
If she needs something.."Sorry mom, we have plans this weekend. We could do it on ---------" pick a day that is convenient for YOU.
"NO" is a complete sentence and needs no further explanation.
She is not receptive to any level of emotion or viewpoint because you cave in and do what she wants to do. If you set boundaries she will get the idea...if not that is her problem NOT yours.
When you became a self-supporting adult, you stopped owing your mother your time or ANY explanation of why you can't "do" for her.
Tell your mother that you have recently started going to therapy and that you've discovered that you've never individuated from her and need space to process these very intense feelings of being smothered by her.
Then stop answering her phone calls for a month.
Let her get on with her life and you get on with yours.
And find a therapist.
PS, forget the other siblings. Mom is an adult. It's high time she started acting like one.
Wow! What a way to start a marriage. I can’t imagine how this feels. Neither my parents, nor my husband’s parents meddled in our personal lives when we were first married.
I know that a sudden death is hard. I am so sorry for the loss of your father. Of course, you would feel compassion for your mom or anyone else in this situation. Still it doesn’t give your mom the right to behave selfishly.
Your mom meddles and is an instigator. What right does she have to say to you that she “discussed” something with your husband? That would be very unnerving for me.
Did you confirm that remark with your husband? Is she taking something out of context in order to be manipulative?
If I were your husband I wouldn’t appreciate being placed in the middle.
I helped my mom out when my father died but it was on my terms. I had a job, so it had to be after work.
I had a husband and children so I had their needs to tend to. I helped my mom when it was convenient for me.
My mom never asked me to rearrange my schedule for her. She wasn’t driving so she couldn’t have driven to my home but even when she drove she never popped in on us unexpectedly.
Your mom is expecting too much from you. It doesn’t seem that you are able to reason with her so stop trying to. Have a plethora of answers ready to go for when she makes her demands and then end the conversation.
It isn’t important for her to understand the answers. You do not have to have her approval. She is the one who is asking you for something, excuse me, demanding something from you.
You are most definitely not required to satisfy her demands. Help her if and when you choose to or tell her that she won’t receive any help at all.
Best wishes to you and your husband.
Pick one day a week that you can be consistent with and that is all the time she gets. Say Mondays 5-8pm If she wants something immediately suggest she call one of her MANY other children and keep doing that. You are only available on Monday.
If she starts to argue or push your boundary, end the phone call. Make up an excuse that you have to get off the phone right away. Or just say "mom we discussed this already I have to go" then hang up. Unless you are financially reliant on her you are the one with all the power.
Calling/texting you and your H at work has to be forbidden. I'd block her number during work hours. Heck, maybe block her number ALL the time except for a few brief periods each day.
She has groomed you to eventually become her 24/7/365 caregiving slave. You are wise to step in now and derail THAT train of thinking!
Question -- do you think your sibs see you as her eventual caregiver? Do they care what she is already going to you? What do they say about it (assuming that they know)?