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Not sure there’s enough info in your question, however one trick I’ve heard is to fib to her and tell her she must go in for Dr exam to keep her Medicare. Just tell her it’s a quickie exam and it’s just to comply with new Medicare laws. If she challenges, just try to convince her laws have changed and it’s a new rule…must get yearly checkups. I’m not sure if it’s a fib or not, but most elderly do not want to risk losing their Medicare.
If her mind isn’t sharp, this should work. Be sure you have a list of things you want the Dr to check on her and be in the room with her.
Is she dependent upon you for getting out of the house? If so, go for the manipulation and bribery ....I will take you to xxx only if we go see your doctor on yyyy.
...also works if the end result is food....we can go for xxx after we see yyyy.
Use this technique sparingly....you don't want her to feel manipulated in any way.
If she is mentally competent, abide with her wishes. If she is not mentally competent, schedule annual exams and those needed when she isn't feeling well. Remind her that she took you as a child to the doctor to keep you well, and now you are doing the same for her.
Except that in old age, "well" is often unreachable. There's no cure for 87 (me) or 94 (my spouse)! Mom may wish to let nature take its course as long as she can be kept clean and comfortable in the process.
Sometimes we must just let the chips fall where they may; ensure your dad is in good hands, get a plan in place for when your mom goes further into decline, and just accept she does not want medical interference of any kind. My mom was indepedent to the point of stubbornness, admirable in some ways but it eventually caused her to die from her own and her HMO doctor's denial of her true condition. You just ensure the loved one has basic comfort and allow them their free will.
Hello, try to set her up with a dr that does home visits. My parents have kaiser, mom has dementia and they have a special home visit program for people that for whatever reason, are unable to go to a dr..in my moms case, its because she has dementia and getting her to physically go is impossible and too much stress. Once established, the drs come to your house and do the typical things that would be done at an office visit except maybe taking weight.
My husband has dementia (undiagnosed) and refuses to go to the doctor because, as he insists, there's nothing wrong with him. He clearly does have some form of dementia, because his behavior is very similar to his mother's when we care for her with her dementia. I recently went to the local clinic by myself and talked with some of the nurses there. I explained our situation, actually started tearing up at one point, and once they understood my predicament, they said that if it turned out that I could not get my husband to come in for a checkup, then the doctor would come to our house. We live in a small, rural town and people here are so kind. I made an appointment for the clinic, and have been reminding myself that I am the boss (I have both a medical and durable POA) and I should not feel guilty for 'pushing' my husband. We women sometimes have trouble with this! That's my two-cents and I hope it might help someone else going through this nightmare called dementia.
I too am looking into a Dr coming to the house. My mom refuses any & all care, medicine or help. She tells us she’s never been to a Dr in her life and has never taken medicine of any kind. Truth is, she was the queen of going to any Dr’s, took every kind of medication given to her well past what it was needed for in the first place. In fact, she was a pharmaceutical addict. One of my harshest punishments was bc my sister and I thru a metal file cabinet of meds into the garbage. Worst “spanking” I ever got…
I feel its important to get tested to see what type of Dementia you are dealing with. Some meds work for one type and not for others. It does not hurt to get labs done. Maybe there is another cause for her symptoms.
The only doctors that I know will come to the home are hospice.Could she be evaluated for palliative care? Maybe if she thinks a doctor is coming to the house she will give in and go. Sounds like she needs a check up.Is there anyone in the family that she would be willing to go with? Sometimes they just want control over the caregiver.
I have never heard of a hospice doctor coming to the home. Its just usually a doctor associated with Hospice who has the ability to prescribe medication. The RN is only one who I have seen visiting. They havevthe expertise.
Over 10 years ago, I encountered the same thing with my now 84 year old Mom. A sibling reported she was not acting herself, couldn’t find her way home from the store, and eventually dragging one leg when she walked…but refused to go to the doctor or hospital. I leveraged her fondness with my adult son to lovingly but firmly get her to the hospital. There she was diagnosed with a mild stroke and NPH dementia. It’s important to note that self neglect is a form of elder abuse! The earlier the diagnosis, the better!
I think that your first objective should be to become POA for both your parents - it might be easier to get your mum to agree if it's something you're all doing as a family to help in the future, rather than something that's being done just for her.
If your dad wants to be POA, then they could become POA for each other, with POA defaulting to you if either one is declared unfit. (At least that's what can happen in the UK where a secondary POA can be named on the application.)
Then, when that's in place, it becomes important to get your mum diagnosed so that the POA can come into effect. This could be done by stealth if your parents go in for an annual check up. Perhaps, if you or Dad has POA, the doctor would be happy to tell you the outcome, instead of Mum. As your mum is forgetful, do something such as going out for lunch after the visit to the doctors to distract her. Don't remind her that she has dementia.
Once that happens, you can manage aspects of Mum's life more easily, such as removing car keys and overseeing medical appointments. Eventually, the decision that may need to be made is whether your mum goes into memory care, or not. It doesn't sound as if you are there yet.
Tell her she's going for a ride somewhere. Depends on legal documents in place. The truth is - you may not be able to 'force' her. If she is considered of 'sound mind,' she can make her own decisions.
Do you parents live in a city or a rural area? Do you physically reside near them? Will your parents accept "helpers" coming into their home? Does anyone have POA for Financial and Medical matters for your parents? (If the answer is "NO", the time to obtain POA is now) If your Dad were to "drop dead" right now (God forbid), what plans are in place as to what should be done with your Mom? No matter where you live, have you explored the possibility of ANY medical practitioners make House Calls, in the area in which your parents reside? Are you keeping a "log" of unusual behavior exhibited by your mother? (You may need this later) Has she gotten lost? Do you are your Dad still allow her to drive? How does your Dad get groceries right now? Who does meal preparation for them? Would your Dad agree to a plan to shift the both of them "out" of their home and into an Assisted Living facility that had a "continuum of care", meaning that if your Mom became unmanageable, she could be moved to the MC portion of the facility but your Dad (back in Assisted living) could still visit her daily or several times a day. What is their financial situation? Would it be necessary to sell their home to move them to a "Continuum of Care" situation? Do either of them have Long Term Care insurance? OK, I am exhausted and probably have exhausted you, also. Do you have siblings who can help you? I do think seeing a Physician is important although there's very little treatment to be had that can make your Mom "better". A thorough physical exam, though, could set a baseline of where she currently charts on Activities of Daily Living. From this baseline, Mom's deterioration could be documented, were legal action needed to have a Legal Guardianship of your mother enacted. My heart goes out to that Sainted father of yours, who will likely pass away first, from exhaustion (both physical and mental) of taking care of your uncooperative mother. Be prepared for that: Were your Mom or a neighbor to call to say, "Your Dad is being taken by ambulance to hospital": What plan would you enact at that point to have proper care and oversight enacted to deal with your mother?
This is an EXCELLENT list of questions that many people would benefit from to print out and post.
I don't understand how you / others know more about a specific post/ person / need than I do (looking at the question here which doesn't mention things you do).
You do not give much information on mom. I presume since you have put this under "dementia" that that is a diagnosis. (I hope you have POA) Unless mom has other medical conditions that require continued monitoring or renewal of prescription what do you need her to go to the doctor for? If mom goes on Hospice (a good possibility) that would eliminate the need for taking her to the doctor. Any prescription can be ordered by the Hospice doctor and delivered. And if a prescription is not necessary maybe it is time to discontinue some of the meds she is on (if any)
But getting to her "refusing" If mom has dementia she no longer has the capacity to make decisions as to her care. YOU or whoever is POA is the decision maker. You do not give her a choice. "Mom, you have an appointment with Dr. Jones today and we will go to lunch after" You tell her this as you are helping her get dressed in the morning. You don't mention it the day before. Sometimes it might even be better to not say anything at all and get her into the car and "go for a ride".
And if getting her into the car is getting impossible or dangerous there are doctors that make house calls.
A doctor has to recommend hospice. If hospice a possibility, she will need to see a doctor first. I don't know if a doctor who makes house calls but has never seen her before and doesn't have her medical records (if any) is going to recommend hospice. based on a house call.
I was in a very similar situation several years ago. Diagnosis can help activate durable power of attorney if you (or your dad) has that for your mom. So if she needs to have finances taken away from her, or car keys, etc, the dr who diagnoses her can write a letter including her diagnosis and recommending this and if can help you. Diagnosis can also help the dr if she needs meds to curb problematic or dangerous behaviors that could drive your dad and you around the bend.
but if it’s impossible to get her diagnosed (and even with cooperative patients it can sometimes be difficult) then you and dad are going to have to manage the best you can in the meantime. It’s really hard, but know shes unlikely to get better. She will almost certainly get worse. I agree with the person who said you can’t do this alone (be your dad’s only support). One drowning person can pull two down with her just by wearing you out.
in My case, my dad starting behaving really erratically in his mid-70s. Luckily he was willing to see a dr because he thought it was just to help him with insomnia. He was really mad about having power over finances taken away from him, but he had been making a lot of terrible mistakes. He was also mad about having the car keys taken away, but he had been in a couple of accidents and getting lost and driving erratically.
he passed recently and now it’s my mom who refuses to see a dr. I don’t think she has dementia but she has other physical issues.
Similar to your parents, they had been married 60 years when he passed.
You may be overemphasizing the importance of dementia testing and diagnosis. You know she has dementia. You've seen many signs of it. She probably knows she has it too. She's going to have dementia with a diagnosis or without. Her attitude is a form of denial; she wants to bury her head in the sand. Understandable.
Saying she'll harm herself? That's like she's manipulating everyone and wanting to be told that you'll do everything to help her, that you couldn't stand it if something happened to her, and so on. Tell her those things to comfort her. By the way, neither of my parents was ever told they had dementia. Doctor doesn't have to tell her, and you and dad don't either. As for doctor, emphasize how she's acting and ask if she can take Aricept or/and Memantine. I've known doctors who have prescribed these based on reports of behavior from family and a simple test in their office. One was an osteopath. (You could download the test from online and casually present the questions over a period of time to see how mom answers the questions; share results with doctor.)
Since she's not navigating well outside the home, make sure she doesn't drive. Too dangerous. Be alert for wandering behavior. All of you get Apple smartwatches and put the FindMe app on all of them. That way you can monitor her moving around and locate her if she gets lost. It has a fall alert that can notify 911 if she falls. You and dad can quietly modify their home - lots of nightlights that switch on when it gets dark, move furniture so there are clear paths, take up moveable rugs, equip bathrooms with grab bars. Prepare, prepare, prepare.
As a last-ditch attempt to get her to the doctor, lie. Tell her she'll lose her Medicare if she doesn't go to her annual exam. Also, there are doctors who will come to her house. Find out if you have some near you.
I feel sorry for dad, and he's going to need help. Don't let it be only you. Don't move them into your home. Push memory care with professionals right from the beginning, and visit some so you'll know what they are like. Be aware that home aides are difficult to manage, and even though it seems like a great solution, it can't be sustained for long. You'd need more than one even with you and dad there.
Good luck, I'm sorry you're all going through this.
That's a great question. Perhaps when potential dementia is diagnosed in someone relatively young and healthy, they may be able to benefit from the new dementia drugs. There's also time to get essential paperwork done and take a look at future living arrangements. In the case of old-old people like my husband (94+) and me (87+), the advantages of a formal diagnosis seem less clear. Our paperwork is done. The aging process will proceed apace. There's no cure for old age and its decline--mental and/or physical--as much as we might wish it so.
Stop expecting mom to acknowledge her memory loss, she cannot do this. Talk to dad privately about the help he needs now and will need as this progresses. Time to see if he has a realistic idea of the situation and future, along with any plans for it
It seems that you think a formal diagnosis of dementia would be an important answer about what is wrong. Perhaps you need to find out more about dementia generally, and this site is a good place to start. Click on ‘Care Topics’ at the top right of the screen, then on D for Dementia on the alphabetic list.
There are different types of dementia, and I am certainly not an expert. Probably the most common is Alzheimers. Finding which type can be useful in telling what to expect about its progression, even if there is nothing much you can do about it. For many types, you can make a reasonable diagnosis from behavior. My understanding that a certain diagnosis can usually come only from an autopsy investigation of the brain, after death, which can show the plaques.
Find out more about this, before making life difficult for all your family members by pushing for a doctor’s diagnosis – or from resisting it.
Do you want her to get tested to see what the doctor says about her cognitive decline? What if he doesn't agree with you because your mom doesn't come off as bad to the doctor as she does to you?
If you get the doctor to confirm exactly what you already know, then what? What do you want done to/for her?
You've stated repeatedly that she'd harm herself if she found out she had dementia. So you want to hide the results of her testing from her if things go south?
Just not sure I'm following what your intended course of action would be.
Since you put your question under the Alzheimer's/dementia category, I'll assume your mother is having dementia behaviors you cannot handle. Next time she's acting up, call 911 and tell the EMS folks you think mom has had a stroke because she's acting crazy and totally out of sorts. Ask that she be taken to the hospital for testing.
HI. Sorry I'm new to this. She refuses to acknowledge she has memory issues. She says if she even thinks she has dementia she will harm herself. She is 84. Lives with my dad....married for 65 years. He is a Saint. He thinks he was put on this earth to take care of her. He is very kind and loving towards her. He always puts her first. She is having memory issues. She knows how to get to some places and others within 2 miles of their home - she can't find. She can have a very normal conversation with people, but those of us that talk to her daily- see that she doesn't remember things that happened this morning or yesterday. We made her doctor aware of this, but he can do very little without testing. We can't get her there even under false pretenses. She is tying our hands. My heart breaks for both of them but especially my dad. I really appreciate your initial answer of calling 911. My Dad doesn't want her in a straight jacket and that's what it would take to get her in an ambulance. :(
A generic answer from me to you Would be that older people have right to and we need to respect those rights to a point, unless your dealing with dementia
Best of luck , if you can let us know more , we can answer it better
HI. Sorry I'm new to this. She refuses to acknowledge she has memory issues. She says if she even thinks she has dementia she will harm herself. She is 84. Lives with my dad....married for 65 years. He is a Saint. He thinks he was put on this earth to take care of her. He is very kind and loving towards her. He always puts her first. She is having memory issues. Knows how to get to some places and others within 2 miles of their home - she can't find. She can have a very normal conversation with people, but those of us that talk to her daily- see that she doesn't remember things that happened this morning or yesterday. We made her doctor aware of this, but he cam do very little without testing. We can't get her there even under false pretenses. She is tying our hands. My heart breaks for both of them but especially my dad
- What country / state does she live in? - Do you live with her? Does anyone? Is she living with you? What's the living arrangement? - Does Mom have an assigned PoA? If so, who is it? - How old is your Mom? - Does she have cognitive/memory imairment? - What is the medical issue she is currently have for which she won't see the doctor?
HI. Sorry I'm new to this. She refuses to acknowledge she has memory issues. She says if she even thinks she has dementia she will harm herself. She is 84. Lives with my dad....married for 65 years. He is a Saint. He thinks he was put on this earth to take care of her. He is very kind and loving towards her. He always puts her first. She is having memory issues. She knows how to get to some places and others within 2 miles of their home - she can't find. She can have a very normal conversation with people, but those of us that talk to her daily- see that she doesn't remember things that happened this morning or yesterday. We made her doctor aware of this, but he can do very little without testing. We can't get her there even under false pretenses. She is tying our hands. My heart breaks for both of them but especially my dad
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If her mind isn’t sharp, this should work. Be sure you have a list of things you want the Dr to check on her and be in the room with her.
...also works if the end result is food....we can go for xxx after we see yyyy.
Use this technique sparingly....you don't want her to feel manipulated in any way.
Have her Medicare provider schedule one. Tell her it is "required" now to keep her Medicare coverage.
There she was diagnosed with a mild stroke and NPH dementia. It’s important to note that self neglect is a form of elder abuse! The earlier the diagnosis, the better!
If your dad wants to be POA, then they could become POA for each other, with POA defaulting to you if either one is declared unfit. (At least that's what can happen in the UK where a secondary POA can be named on the application.)
Then, when that's in place, it becomes important to get your mum diagnosed so that the POA can come into effect. This could be done by stealth if your parents go in for an annual check up. Perhaps, if you or Dad has POA, the doctor would be happy to tell you the outcome, instead of Mum.
As your mum is forgetful, do something such as going out for lunch after the visit to the doctors to distract her. Don't remind her that she has dementia.
Once that happens, you can manage aspects of Mum's life more easily, such as removing car keys and overseeing medical appointments. Eventually, the decision that may need to be made is whether your mum goes into memory care, or not. It doesn't sound as if you are there yet.
Depends on legal documents in place.
The truth is - you may not be able to 'force' her.
If she is considered of 'sound mind,' she can make her own decisions.
Gena / Touch
I don't understand how you / others know more about a specific post/ person / need than I do (looking at the question here which doesn't mention things you do).
Gena / Touch Matters
(I hope you have POA)
Unless mom has other medical conditions that require continued monitoring or renewal of prescription what do you need her to go to the doctor for?
If mom goes on Hospice (a good possibility) that would eliminate the need for taking her to the doctor. Any prescription can be ordered by the Hospice doctor and delivered.
And if a prescription is not necessary maybe it is time to discontinue some of the meds she is on (if any)
But getting to her "refusing"
If mom has dementia she no longer has the capacity to make decisions as to her care. YOU or whoever is POA is the decision maker. You do not give her a choice. "Mom, you have an appointment with Dr. Jones today and we will go to lunch after" You tell her this as you are helping her get dressed in the morning. You don't mention it the day before. Sometimes it might even be better to not say anything at all and get her into the car and "go for a ride".
And if getting her into the car is getting impossible or dangerous there are doctors that make house calls.
but if it’s impossible to get her diagnosed (and even with cooperative patients it can sometimes be difficult) then you and dad are going to have to manage the best you can in the meantime. It’s really hard, but know shes unlikely to get better. She will almost certainly get worse. I agree with the person who said you can’t do this alone (be your dad’s only support). One drowning person can pull two down with her just by wearing you out.
in My case, my dad starting behaving really erratically in his mid-70s. Luckily he was willing to see a dr because he thought it was just to help him with insomnia. He was really mad about having power over finances taken away from him, but he had been making a lot of terrible mistakes. He was also mad about having the car keys taken away, but he had been in a couple of accidents and getting lost and driving erratically.
he passed recently and now it’s my mom who refuses to see a dr. I don’t think she has dementia but she has other physical issues.
Similar to your parents, they had been married 60 years when he passed.
best wishes to you.
Saying she'll harm herself? That's like she's manipulating everyone and wanting to be told that you'll do everything to help her, that you couldn't stand it if something happened to her, and so on. Tell her those things to comfort her. By the way, neither of my parents was ever told they had dementia. Doctor doesn't have to tell her, and you and dad don't either. As for doctor, emphasize how she's acting and ask if she can take Aricept or/and Memantine. I've known doctors who have prescribed these based on reports of behavior from family and a simple test in their office. One was an osteopath. (You could download the test from online and casually present the questions over a period of time to see how mom answers the questions; share results with doctor.)
Since she's not navigating well outside the home, make sure she doesn't drive. Too dangerous. Be alert for wandering behavior. All of you get Apple smartwatches and put the FindMe app on all of them. That way you can monitor her moving around and locate her if she gets lost. It has a fall alert that can notify 911 if she falls. You and dad can quietly modify their home - lots of nightlights that switch on when it gets dark, move furniture so there are clear paths, take up moveable rugs, equip bathrooms with grab bars. Prepare, prepare, prepare.
As a last-ditch attempt to get her to the doctor, lie. Tell her she'll lose her Medicare if she doesn't go to her annual exam. Also, there are doctors who will come to her house. Find out if you have some near you.
I feel sorry for dad, and he's going to need help. Don't let it be only you. Don't move them into your home. Push memory care with professionals right from the beginning, and visit some so you'll know what they are like. Be aware that home aides are difficult to manage, and even though it seems like a great solution, it can't be sustained for long. You'd need more than one even with you and dad there.
Good luck, I'm sorry you're all going through this.
There are different types of dementia, and I am certainly not an expert. Probably the most common is Alzheimers. Finding which type can be useful in telling what to expect about its progression, even if there is nothing much you can do about it. For many types, you can make a reasonable diagnosis from behavior. My understanding that a certain diagnosis can usually come only from an autopsy investigation of the brain, after death, which can show the plaques.
Find out more about this, before making life difficult for all your family members by pushing for a doctor’s diagnosis – or from resisting it.
If you get the doctor to confirm exactly what you already know, then what? What do you want done to/for her?
You've stated repeatedly that she'd harm herself if she found out she had dementia. So you want to hide the results of her testing from her if things go south?
Just not sure I'm following what your intended course of action would be.
I really appreciate your initial answer of calling 911. My Dad doesn't want her in a straight jacket and that's what it would take to get her in an ambulance. :(
How old is your mom?
Her symptoms?
A generic answer from me to you
Would be that older people have right to and we need to respect those rights to a point, unless your dealing with dementia
Best of luck , if you can let us know more , we can answer it better
- What country / state does she live in?
- Do you live with her? Does anyone? Is she living with you? What's the living arrangement?
- Does Mom have an assigned PoA? If so, who is it?
- How old is your Mom?
- Does she have cognitive/memory imairment?
- What is the medical issue she is currently have for which she won't see the doctor?
If she won't go the doctor then call 911.