I made a huge mistake thinking my mom would let me help once she moved in. Advice?

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I made a huge mistake thinking my mom would let me help once she moved in. Advice?

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My mom (78) moved in with us in December 21 due to financial hardship. We talked beforehand, and agreed we would apply and seek HUD senior housing. She is healthy, drives and works PT as a "greeter" since Feb.

She moved from Texas to MI so I could help her. My siblings and I packed and paid 100% for the move.

I hand delivered the sr. hud applications and was told 1-2 year waiting list. 2 have come available, one I knew about, and one she never told me about.

She refused the one we both looked at "too dark and depressing", too far from her activities. The 2nd one she never told me they called her with an opening. I consider that lying.

She has been told, she must find a place of her own. She has a bankruptcy from 2016 and around $15,000 in credit card debt now that I didn't know about prior to her moving in.

I am at a loss and my DH has lost patience with her "entitlement". My siblings and I have all told her, she has to actively seek housing,

She has no $$ (other than SS), no saving and no plans for her future. I work FT and she lives in our basement, so stairs. Laundry room is on 2nd level of our home. So, more stairs. She will not talk about her "future" and what arrangements we might make for the next phase of her life. She cannot and will not address what happens when she cannot do stairs.

she refused to sign POA (financial) and refuses all attempt and resources to help. She was assigned a case manager at Area Agency on Aging but refuses to speak to them or return calls.

I want her out of my home. I am willing to help in many ways, but the refusal to accept a home she can afford is not acceptable. Her pride and stubbornness has wrecked our relationship. She tells me she is not interested in HUD Sr. Housing, but is going in a different direction. She told me she would be out 5/1, then 6/1 and now has a few boxes sitting around as if she is packing. She tells me she is moving to Arkansas as soon as her "work transfer" goes through. My siblings and I have voiced or non support for this plan, and have no idea how she thinks she can pull this off. Realistically, no one will rent to her based upon her income and credit. but she refused to see that reality.

I am considering a consult with an attorney about seeking a court appointed guardianship so someone can act on her behalf and best interests.

I made a huge mistake thinking she would let me help once she moved in.

Advice? Thoughts?

Debt Multi-generational Living Relationships Senior Housing

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Unfortunately, every day people come to Forum for advice when it is already too late.

Your home is now your mother's home.
That's a fact. Short of eviction there is now no way to remove your mother from your home. You would need to see a landlord/tenant attorney to remove her if she does not leave voluntarily. Given you have encouraged her to exit her home state, any familiarity she had, and even minimal support, this is all made more difficult.

You have painted yourself into a corner. You have moved into your home someone with ZERO intention to leave it, someone perfectly happy with the present circumstances. She has never been responsible. She won't start now. People don't easily change.

You and your hubby unfortunately serve as a lesson to others. I am so sorry, but you are in a horrible position here.

My advice? You and your husband should go to a Licensed Social Worker in private counseling practice and tell that person the above; you should get options on moving forward toward getting your mother out of your home without her ending up homeless under a bridge. Your options will be very tough and very unsatisfactory. You should then have a sitdown talk, you, your husband, and your mother. Next stop may be an attorney. And that not good enough, dark apartment? I would advise someone to grab it. Otherwise, get ready for the long haul of living together, which will not get better, but rather very much worse.

I am so very sorry.

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@AlvaNot necessarily. If a person doesn't pay rent they don't have the same rights as someone who does. The mother is a guest. Guests don't pay rent so they are in the home at the discretion of the homeowner. You can throw a guest out of your house. It depends on what state you're in.A fellow caregiver and friend I've known for years recently had her live-in caregiver position end. She took care of the client and lived in the client's home for nearly seven years. The client's son and daughter showed up from another state when they heard their father had died and told her she had a week to get packed and get out. Luckily her sister was able to take her in because she has room. My point is, the family gave her a week because she wasn't a renter so doesn't have renter's rights. Maybe she could have squatted but then she has some class and respect for herself and would never do that. So the OP may have some options here that won't involve having to let her mother stay or formally evicting her.

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You will need to contact your county's courthouse to find out what the evictiion process (and cost) is to start. It is usually 30 days after posting the eviction notice at your house.

You can inform your Mom that if she doesn't assign someone as PoA then eventually the county will acquire guardianship of her once she is a vulnerable adult who cannot perform her ADLs or is a danger to herself or others. Ask her if she'd really rather have the county be in 100% control of her life at that point, or one of her children.

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It's pretty clear that your mother likes your home and has no intentions of moving anywhere else unless the court literally has her evicted from your house.

Here is how I would handle her beating around the bush procrastinating and finding fault with the apartments that have become available.
Tell her plainly that if you have to involve the court and have her evicted that your relationship with her is over. You will have no contact with her whatsoever. That the only time you will even speak of her is when you're making her funeral arrangements.
She takes the apartment available to her or she will be dead to you.
Put it to her in these terms and she will go on her own into the available apartment.

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Welcome back

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Dear OP, I am in a very similar boat with my mom. She's been in my home for 15 months and it has been living hell. I have her on a HUD senior apt. list as well. However, I am the contact so when her name comes up, I will take it for her. I will move her in dingy or not.

In the meantime, I am so desperate to get her out of my home, I found a senior roommates web site that allows renters and landlords to connect. I signed her up. It created matches for her and I then discussed with her how she would like to rent a room from another older person. She actually liked the idea. I read her the matches last night and she liked 2 of them. We responded to them together. One of them responded back. I am beginning to be hopeful. If I can make this work and get her out of my house, then there will be no coming back. If this doesn't work, I am going to evict her and be done with her.

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Wow. Your mother has lied to you by omission-- the $15k debt and "ignoring" the house opening. As others have said, mother has no intention of moving out and never did. The "I'm waiting for a work transfer" is total BS if she is a greeter (I will assume it's a place that starts with 'Wal' and ends in 'Mart' or something like it). That's not a position that requires an approved transfer. She could move to Arkansas and be hired again there easily. She will use the 'waiting for a transfer' excuse to keep delaying. She isn't worried about being unable to go up and down the stairs in your house because she's sure you will accommodate her one way or another.

Evicting her will probably make you feel terrible. Even though she NEEDS to get out of your home. And she will probably react with guilt tactics... "You're kicking out your own mother! I'll be on the streets! Shame on you!". Remind her that she brought this on herself. Lying by omission and having no plan for her future. If she had been honest in the beginning it would be easier to have a little sympathy towards her. She is using you and no one likes to be used. And it’s not okay.

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You make sure your are the HUD contact. If an apt comes available, you give her no choice, she takes it. She has lost the right to choose when she conveniently forgot to tell you about the call. HUD will take about 30% of her SS for rent, Heat should be included. Electric and cable will be her responsibility. She may be able to get help with her electric. Her TV, she can get an antenna and stream free so no monthly cost. You can go to Social Services and see if she fits the criteria for SSI which is a supplemental income. It may give her a few extra dollars. She can get food stamps. Once she is in the apt, find her resources by calling the Office of Aging. They may provide bussing for appts and shopping.

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My mother wasn't mobile and was bed ridden. I took care of her to the day she departed this earth. Yes, it was hard until her health failed. I would give anything to hear my mother's voice or to see her. This is the person took care of you until you could do things for yourself. Please work with your mother and let her know everything you're doing is for the love you have her. I guarantee you, she will come around.

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This is NOT a helpful reply and I reported it. Delete this.

I accidentally said it’s a helpful post so now it has a star.

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I wound up on Section 8/HUD Voucher. Each Housing office runs its own rules even tho it is a federal program. There are 'payment standards' based on housing costs in each area. Landlords who accept Vouchers are not screened; inspections at time of signing a lease can make or break a move-in. HUD apartments are often 'bare bones', and often in very 'sketchy' areas. Individual houses can be decent or rat traps. You are approved if the rent is going to be within 30-40% of your income, you pay your portion and HUD pays the difference directly to the landlord, and utilities are not covered unless the rent includes any of them. Deposits are at the discretion of the landlord and tenant's agreement; my lease states an Automatic 20% annual rent increase; who automatically has 20% more income for rent when you are low income/disabled? It's a rough road, even tho helpful in many situations. One good thing is a HUD Section 8 Voucher is 'portable' to other Housing offices but it is a big process, sending your info back and forth to your original office.

All this said, this mom is taking unfair advantage. If she is still healthy, has a job, a car, she needs to move out. Please put your foot down, set a deadline, don't be guilted into caving. I don't agree you must 'divorce' your mother, unless she's abusive some way; just tell her you did not foresee some of the details that have come to light since bringing her into your home. It was a Temporary solution; just be firm, honest, and proceed deliberately. See if you can be the contact person for her HUD listings, so mom can't evade picking a dwelling.

If she claims she's moving to Arkansas, wish her well, and let the chips fall where they may. When my mom's stubbornness became too much I asked her area's agency of Aging what becomes of such a senior: they told me to stop helping, let nature take its course; if the elder is disabled the state steps in and places them wherever there is an opening. Your mother will be her own boss, entirely, and have to deal with that reality. You've realized you 'made a mistake', so stop digging that hole, change course; you've done more than many would, commendable, but it takes two to tango: your mother is not cooperating and you/your siblings cannot help if your mom does not do her part. She cannot 'squat' in your home. Gone are the days when elders just stayed with their families automatically; as lovely as the concept of 'extended family' sounds those situations were not always 'a bed of roses' for the families and I suspect miserable/abusive more often than not.

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MImom, I recommend that you do NOT seek guardianship over a healthy, still driving and still working adult. I would instead treat her as the functional adult she is.

First, she should be paying a share of household expenses equivalent to what other adults in the household pays. Just search Craigslist for rooms and basements for rent and utilities in your area. If she’s eating the family’s food, she should be paying her proportionate share.

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No one answered about guardianship. That will not work since she is of sound mind and it would be difficult to get a doctor to agree. Persue the evicition. I like the idea that you need to sit her down and tell her this will happen.

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I have no experience with HUD housing. However, I do have experience with a mother who refused to plan for her elder years. My twin brother and I tried multiple times to convince her to at least move out of her split-level house and into a ranch. But no. Well, what about this cute townhouse that's one level, or has a master on the first floor? No no no. Drama ensued to the point that we threw in the towel.

Fast forward to my current situation. My brother is deceased now and I had to bring my mother to live with me 6 years ago - yes, because of a promise that she tearfully asked me to make - and because my role growing up was to please everyone and not make waves.

So...based on my experience with stubborn parents who refuse to deal with reality, and don't mind being a burden, even when it's not necessary.....she won't change.

You are going to have to make some uncomfortable decisions and take some tough actions if you don't want your mother to live out her life in your home.

I wish you the best.

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Yeah my parents had their heads up their collective a**. Because of lack of prior planning my mother is bleeding through her money, my father is awaiting a Medicaid decision while sitting in a nursing home. My mother had to do a spousal waiver. Hope we have a decision soon.

My mother should not be living in her home alone but the sad fact is her daughters don’t like her enough to invite her to live with one of us. we just hope and pray for the next crisis to come quickly so we can place her in the NH via the hospital,

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She is content where she is.

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Yes, consult with an Elder Law Attorney for legal help navigating through this mindfield ; you should be able to get an initial consult gratis with one to hear a summary of what you are dealing with. Then it would be of course up to you to decide if you want to use their expertise further for fee. The fee may be well worth it for both your own sanity and legal knowledge of options, vulnerability etc. And, it should give impt directions for your mother to be clear on; now as you say, she may not listen, but you will have the bottom line options about where you and family members draw the line on accountability and what documents etc to put in place .

You may also want to get a
" cognitive assessment " completed on your mother to determine her true ability to make safe decisions ( physical, financial, emotional etc).
If you could get her to go to a PCP as a " checkup" for her health, you could request that also.
Getting this done will be impt. and could potentially help the difficult decisions that lie ahead for you and your family. It certainly sounds like she is in denial about the reality ( ies) and, this denial could be coming from many sources ( as you say, pride etc) but also could be impacted by physical health( mental status) negatively affecting her decision making. Guilt and grief and fear are probably more contributing factors.

If you affiliate with a faith, try to get your faith leader involved for possible spiritual and emotional support for you and your family: sometimes they can also help with an actual " intervention" with the troubled person to try and bring about a reckoning to reality and consequences associated with past, present and future actions; or a community based chaplain or licensed social worker may be helpful.

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The cognitive assessment can be done although this is really not the responsibility of this daughter. This is continuing to be a 'co-dependant' and this won't hope the daughter.

Equally, I think the daughter can handle this w/o incurring attorney fees. A lock on the door will cost $10.00 - or less.

The mother needs to learn 'the hard way' that she needs to be responsible for herself. She is conniving and manipulative. She knows what she is doing.

The daughter could also drop her off at a church, if not a homeless shelter. The daughter could give her mother this choice: church or homeless shelter. The key here is the choice of two options. There is no wiggle room to stay where she is.

However, empty threats will result in the situation continuing - and getting worse. The daughter needs to carry out her intentions. Put them in writing, (perhaps have the mother sign it "I understand..." and date it.
Make it official - this is serious.

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If she refuses the help you offer and you see no way to get her out of YOUR home and she resides in the basement, then lock the door to the upstairs so she has no way to come into YOUR part of the house. I would think there would be an outside door in the basement . Only if she has a toilet and sink will this work. She can get a fridge at used appliance store. Habitat re-store has tv's and appliances. Microwaves can be bought for under $100. Any phone calls to her could come to YOUR phone so you are aware of what she is doing. Ignore her and do NOT invite her upstairs for ANY reason (holiday celebrations, etc)! Make sure she doesn't have a key to YOUR front door. She can go to laundromat and use her S.S. $$ for food and her Medicare for health/medical problems. In other words, "SHUN" her until she agrees to leave. Let her know her leaving is the ONLY way to get back into her children's good graces and be a member of the family again. This post is just "food for thought" and maybe others can come up with better ideas that don't involve lawyers, court, etc.

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Even better if there is no outside door! Lock the door from the basement to the main house, then check in on her in a few months. Chances are the situation will have resolved itself!

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Legally evict her.

Then once she’s gone provide no help for this awful person. If she sleeps under a bridge because of stubbornness or general stupidity, she’ll be one of many.

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Yes. Good point. Legal eviction.

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Almost any mistake in life can be fixed. Only very few mistakes have absolutely no solution.

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Of course with my luck, all of MY mistakes have no solution.

Just kidding.

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As you say "I am at a loss and my DH has lost patience with her "entitlement". My siblings and I have all told her, she has to actively seek housing,"

Know that she will not change.
She has a 'comfortable' situation with you now.
Telling her she 'has to actively seek housing' is where your conundrum comes in - she won't do that and you need to realize this. When you realize she won't do anything to leave, you will then know that you need to make arrangements for her to move out of your home 'by any means necessary.'

* While this may feel / seem harsh, she will continue to take advantage of you / your sister / the rest of the family until she sucks you dry (emotionally and every other way).

If you need to take legal action or get the paperwork together yourself 'for her,' do that.

Or

Find her an air bnb in Arkansas ... she can stay there until the work transfer goes through (which likely it never will).

You need to learn to set (these) boundaries or suffer the consequences.

Be kind to yourself. I would rephrase that you 'made a mistake.' You did this out of the kindness of your heart with loving intentions. This is commendable. Now you know the 'writing on the wall,' and must take action.

Once she realizes that you are SERIOUS, she may do what she needs to do (althugh I wouldn't bet money on it). If she doesn't, tell her "I am taking you to a homeless shelter on (date) if you do not make other arrangements by that date. Then do it. Drop her off.

You need a life of your own.
You will never ever have any peace if you allow this to continue.
These relationships are 'written in cement' from an early age. It may feel hard for you to make these decisions / set boundaries. It is called TOUGH LOVE. And, it is love. It just may not feel that way. You need to learn to value yourself, put yourself first (in this situation) esp after you opened your home to her and see how things are going.

Gena / Touch Matters

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Mlmom78: Perhaps you need to retain an elder law attorney. Unfortunately your decision to move your mother in with you is now becoming near impossible to negate. However, don't be so hard on yourself; your intentions were loving and kind.

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Won't seek housing? Or can't?

Sometimes planning is the first part of the brain to show decline.

78 may be harder than at 28, 48 or 68 to relocate & thrive but is certainly possible.

I'm not familiar with HUD but our public housing lists can be 10yrs long or never for people without disability, homelessness or both. I believe same deal in that if 2 offers are declined - applicant is off the list (or sent to the bottom).

I agree the OP should become the new HUD contact. I'd make contact & explain their had been a *mix-up* with the last contact & plead to get back on the list.

While I usually suggest elders stay as independant as they can, a housing offer for Mom directly effects the OP. Therefore I feel it reasonable the OP gets a say.

That's how I'd put it to Mom:
You are a guest here Mom. Your being here means your longer term housing now effects us BOTH. Therefore I will be a joint HUD contact. We will discuss the next offer you get.

"Mom, you may need to change your expectations, use the 1st HUD offer as a stepping stone.
You can pretty the place up as you wish".

It all depends what you compare to.

A small dark apartment may be poor against your her home.
But be all HER space."

Renting privately (?air bnb) may turn up a nicer room in a nicer house, nicer area. May have shared kitchen, living, bathroom but how much private space does she need?

She can ask herself what does she REALLY need for a good life?

A friend rents a one bed flat right near the sea. A LO rents just a bedroom with kitchenette, in a vibrant, bustling but affordable area.

WHERE does she really want to be?

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Hi,
I am very sorry but AlvaDeer is right.
Someone else said to just evict her and that she has no rental rights - forgetting all the while that she is your mother.
Legal counsel is the only way to go now, I thought the social worker option was good too. It is going to cause problems between you and your husband, so someone who can counsel you through this situation would help.
If she really has a work opportunity, then you won't be kicking her out, but I don't think that's true.
I like your idea of PoA, and then you can accept housing for her.
The fact that she didn't tell you about the second offer, tells me that as far as she's concerned, she is at home.
These forums are full of people who have gone through what you're going through, so keep coming back, and read other people's situations and the responses. Most of these issues are really about boundaries and how to set them with elderly parents who have issues.

I wish you all the best.

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I feel that any adult should make sure they give Power of Attorney over finances and over medical decisions to their next of kin. First off it is only used if you cannot make the decisions for yourself - such as being in a coma. And I wouldn't wait until I was an older person. The POA ends when a person passes away also so the executor of the Will will then control everything.

Your mother does not want to leave your house and I really hate people saying to evict her or throw her out. As long as she was an adequate parent, everyone stop being hateful. Your parents didn't throw you out did they?

You and your siblings move her to a different state, now she is already working PT and has activities - you should be glad for that. Many seniors sit there and do nothing all day and night! And now she is saying she is moving to another state.

If you cannot let her stay with you then maybe she and you can find her a roommate to rent a 2 bedroom apartment together. She works and has activities she might have met someone that is a friend and may be beneficial to all.

I seriously doubt that the courts would take her rights away simply because you moved her in and now want her out. She is working and has 2 forms of income, she is not destitute. If you are worried about the stairs, face that problem when it happens. Don't make it a problem before it becomes one! Good Luck!

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The mom moved in knowing it was not permanent. That was made clear. It's not like daughter blindsided mom with this. Mom needs to follow through on the HUD housing so she can move out.

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Let her go to Arkansas . You can not get guardianship over a functioning adult or POA . Do you really know her mental state ? She sounds frightened and to be Honest most Senior HUD housing are shitholes from what I have experienced - you can hear thru the walls , people die constantly , bed bugs . I could write a few stories of where my Mom lived . Sometimes you have to put yourself in their shoes . She is physically active and driving , works . It’s her life . She gave up 20 years of her life for you . People are funny . One Day she will be gone and you will miss her .

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It sounds like you have been very kind and helpful to your Mom. I am glad that she is able do for herself. She should continue to do so for as long as she can. It would be so much more difficult if she couldn’t. I would sit down with her and talk to her about what she is thinking and let her know exactly how you feel. A car ride with just the two of you might help her listen better. She is in an unfamiliar area and may just feel afraid. It has not been very long since she just moved. Being at your home may be the only thing keeping her connected to her environment and feeling secure. Since we really don’t know how you get along with her, it’s hard to recommend the right situation for a living arrangement. If you do get along fairly well, maybe you could fix up an area in your basement with a kitchenette, bath, etc. and keep the door locked to the upstairs-as long as there is a walk out area from downstairs. You could let her know that her space is downstairs, set boundaries and designate days for dining together, laundry, etc. Maybe some of her income could be used to help you with household expenses, or eventually with her care if she stays. If you definitely can not live with her, we all understand how difficult that can be, you will probably have to go with her to look at subsidized apartments and help her move again. The longer she is with you, the more difficult it will be to get her into her own place. In five to ten years, she may need more assistance and not be able to live on her own. That would involve another type of living arrangement. I know it’s all on you with the help of your sibling, but think about the future in your planning with her. Either way, it’s not a piece of cake. I would check with the Aging Council and Social Services in your area for advice and information. Additionally, it might help her to go to a senior center during the day to be with others her own age-if one is available. I pray for a resolution and for your peace of mind through this continuing transition. All the best!

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Your mom may be having some cognitive issues. In the beginning, I thought my mom was just being an ass. Saying off the wall things to me, cancelling plans we had made when I arrived to pick her up with no explanation. Turned out she didn't remember that we had plans and she played it off like she just didn't want to go. In the beginning, they cover up their confusion very well. She hadn't remembered to make her house payment and was having hallucinations...became super paranoid. I did not have a clue and she never said a thing. We had never had a case of dementia in the family so it wasn't on my radar. If there is any way you can get your mom to a doctor who specializes in testing people for dementia, I strongly suggest it. You might be surprised at what her issue truly is.

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I made a huge mistake thinking my mom would let me help once she moved in. Advice?

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