We've heard that we can and that we cannot be held liable for my wife's parents' unpaid bills. Her dad, sadly, passed recently. Her mom is in a rehab racking up a significant bill while we try to figure out how to get Medicaid and a different long term facility.
None of the accounts are joint with either my wife or me on them.
I did sign as a family member to get MIL into the rehab, but the intake agreement does not make me liable. My wife and I just got guardianship. If the payment from Medicaid takes too long or the sale of her house takes too long, can I be held responsible for her rehab bill?
Thanks! We're Runragged.
As long as you didn't sign anything stating that you will be responsible for the bill at the facility if she is unable to pay you'll be fine.
As guardian you are responsible to disperse your MIL's monies to satisfy outstanding debts and for her board and care but you would do that with her money and not yours.
I would read the DPOA carefully - especially if it was an online form that someone downloaded.
As to the bills, my understanding is the same as Eyerishlass, that unless you agreed, personally and not as attorney-in-fact, that you are not liable for them.
However, another member, Pam Stegman, raised an important issue on another post, which is filial responsibility, holding some adult children responsbible for aspects of their parents' care.
After reading Pam's post, I did some research, the results of which were unsettling in terms of responsibility for parental care.
You might want to Google "filial responsiblity (your state) to determine if this is even an issue. If your state has adopted it, I think I would do as much research as I can on case law holdings, then contact an attorney for clarficiation.
I don't know whether filial responsibility might be applicable for actions INITIATED before you and your wife acquired guardianship, or whether it would come into play if funds are exhausted eventually. That's well beyond my limited scope of knowledge and a question for an attorney.
My experience with guardianships is also from a different perspective, that of working for attorneys who handled guardianship proceedings, so I'm not familiar with individual financial liability other than to have seen that guardians are expected to use the funds of the person over whom they have guardianship.
Does the order of appointment address this issue, including options if funds are exhausted?
I won't even try to answer the issue of interim responsibility pending Medicaid qualification, but leave that to Igloo who's the resident expert.
In New Hampshire the law permits the State to recover any expenses from the financial professionals that provided the advice too.
Does this include some one who is attorney in fact, POA
Medicare will pay for needed rehab up to 120 days not Medicaid. However, once it is deemed she is not requiring rehab, she either goes home or if a placement is needed for nursing home, then she would need to spend down all that she owns basically. Medicaid does not pay for nursing homes while the elder has financial assets, only after they have been exhausted or spent.
Giving the price of good nursing homes for private pay, she will run through her assets very quickly. People start paperwork for the Medicaid program (medical care for the poor) once the elder is placed and it is assumed they will end their days in the nursing home. Then you have to find a nursing home which is acceptable to you and which accepts Medicaid patients. Most nursing homes accept some Medicaid patients but they prefer private pay as they make more money with private pay.
Sorry to hear of the father's passing. I am guessing he was the caregiver for the mother. I would get a medical opinion from MIL doctor as to whether with home health aides she needs a NH. If she can be cared for home, a. she will probably prefer it, b. it is normally cheaper than private pay nursing homes. Plus if she is under 85 years, it may be too early for a nursing home placement if she does not suffer from a known life ending disease like cancer. If she is just having age related problems, she should be able to be supported in the home.
You have the power to bring her home from rehab, get supportive therapies (OT, PT from Medicare) and hire a live in or HHA for a few hours a day if she
is capable of being left alone for parts of the day or evenings. The MIL's personal doctor should be able to advise you on her progress.
However, even if you get her placed in a NH, she will continue to need your help. So I would investigate home care ---a very last resort should be a nursing home for an unknown extended number of years. Many people rush to a nursing home out of fear but old age is what it is. Not something to be feared or run from but accept it as part of life. It can be managed at a home setting.
Good luck.
When you contact these agencies, you can also advise them of your complaint against the nursing home and that they "broke his hip" but be very certain that your allegations are supported by facts, dates, and people involved.
Have they involved a collection agency yet? If not, and if they do, make sure you respond in 30 days advising that the debt is not yours and you're not responsible. If you don't respond, under the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act the debt will be assumed to be valid.
It wouldn't hurt to file a fraud report with one of the 3 credit reporting agencies (I don't remember offhand which is the best to file with, as 2 of them tried to charge the last time I filed a 90 day fruad alert). You'll get an initial acknowledgement which offers the opportunity to get copies of your credit report from all 3 agencies. Do that, then notify them of the dispute and state that it's contested. If I recall correctly, that's supposed to be noted on your credit file.
Sorry to learn you're having such a rough time with them, but appreciate your sharing as it's a wake-up call as to what can happen.
and find your particular state.
Are you liable? Yes, if you make a mistake, such as:
Pay credit cards bills or utility bills, but not the Nursing Home.
Sign your name but don't write POA after your signature
Sign your name but don't write GUARDIAN after your signature.
Fail to sign over the entire SS check to the nursing home or refuse to make them representative payee.
Gift away the car / house / stocks / savings or anything with market value.
Pay yourself without a written contract for care or board.
Our situation is out of the ordinary. My wife's sibling committed pretty serious POA abuse, so we've taken over.
In our state, there is not a filial law that makes us liable for unpaid debts, according to what our attorney told us. If those with POA or guardianship are responsible for the unpaid balances, then no one will take on these roles.
A case in Pennsylvania from a couple of years ago apparently has stirred this issue up significantly - hh-law/news/pennsylvania-filial-support-law.aspx. A son who's mother left the country was left with his mother's nursing home bill because the courts felt he had the ability to pay it and he was the last family member left in the county.
I asked my own attorney this (because of continuing troubles with my Sis who is IMHO a very bad POA) and he basically said, there is no one who oversees POA. It is all up to the family, or community, to identify any wrongs done--after they're done--and then anybody who has a LOT of money to petition for guardianship (like $20-30,000) can try to get guardianship, which is in fact overseen.
But the POA's, nobody checks up on them. Unless someone like you or me does, and then if we get concerned, we have to shell out our own bucks to try to change the problem.....the POA can use the older persons' money to protect themselves! And that is very sad.