Kwiemer Asked May 31, 2024
Power of Attorney denied?
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I am POA for my dad. He has a bank/checking account in Minnesota. I'm trying to consolidate all his funds into one in Iowa to make it easier, well, for me.
I called this bank in Minnesota and she told me that they will not accept the POA, and that I have to bring it to the branch so they, the bank, can notarize it.
Has anyone else run into this?
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This is why I ALWAYS caution people never to do their own online POA. Firstly, there is no attorney to examine the principal (Dad) for competency to give POA. Secondly a notarization means nothing; it is a simple attesting to the truth of a signature, not to the competency mentally of the principal to confer POA.
Often people pull these offline and do them, and then when they try to use them they are no good, and it is too late because the principal has fallen into deep dementia and can no longer do the POA.
Not only did the bank not help my brother and me, they didn't even tell us what we needed was POA AND Trustee of Trust. So back we had to go to the attorney. An easy 5,000 all in all in So Cal. Once the paperwork was correct the bank gave us a special officer to contact and all went beautifully after that (US Bank).
K, this is your second problem.
You are going to need to attend, I think, an elder law attorney with your Dad and your POA and see what's what and what's needed. Your dad, as principal, pays for this out of his SS or whatever funds he has. The first year of doing all this was, for me a total nightmare of anxiety.
Banks require you to bring all your POA paperwork and letters testamentary to them and to sit with an officer and get a bank account changed so that only the POA can write checks; they tell you HOW to write the checks. They will set up a small spending account for Dad if he wishes it. And etc. They will check out the POA thoroughly as to what powers it gives you, make copies of it and etc. Be very careful about any changing of things that affects the SS check as SS doesn't accept POA and is a whole other ball of wax you may soon get stuck on.
I do suggest an attorney. This is problem number two and for the first year you are going to have a lot of problems while you deal with getting medicare bills mailed to you, changes of address, bank accounts and finding all entities you dad was involved with and registering as POA. You are going to have to do this with everything. Even his cable company. I know for me it was the most anxiety ridden year of my entire life serving as POA and Trustee for my bro, and that includes a bout with breast cancer. So I am only trying to forewarn you, protect you, and give you some pointers.
Banks are beyond careful with this stuff.
Should I just have dad, because he is of sound mind just deaf, write a check from the one we are trying to close for the amount in his savings to his new bank. We are not talking a lot of money, just a couple thousand
If you see Igloo572 out and about on the Forum she is pretty brilliant at this SS stuff.
By the way, it is illegal for a bank to refuse a POA done by an attorney so when you are seated with a bank officer you may need to remind him that your POA was done with an attorney, is a valid document, and while you understand he is there to attempt to help you, it is illegal to INTERFERE with your duties.
Also this is a bank only in Minnesota, the closest is a couple hrs away. So I was hopeful to send it in the mail?
You are an Iowa resident who does not have a bank account at a bank based in Minnesota, the bank takes the position that as you do not have an account it has zero reason to be accommodating. If the Notary and the Attorney, both only registered in Iowa, their legal authority cannot be verified.
But the bank has to be accommodating to its accounts holders, which means your dad is able to do whatever changes need to be done. The bank will more than likely want dad to be able to on his own sitting in a bank officers lil office appear competent and cognitive to answer any questions as to his wanting his accounts closed or wanting to add a signature onto his accounts AND they will have a fresh POA for dad to sign to allow for you to do whatevers on Dads accounts. Bank will also want to have your ID on file so take 2 if at all possible along with the new bank account info (last statements).
Dad is not dead, so what in his will does not matter. Just like what he indicates he wants distributed as per his will does NOT yet matter, as assets can get sold or dispersed before death so the terms of the will change. I will say this as someone who has been an Executor 3 times, if that will was done in MN and he dies in Iowa or vice versa, it’s going to be a buttrash to deal with. Ditto for owning property in 1 state but dies as a resident of another.
She is terrifically knowledgeable. Sometime she knows so danged much I can't even follow it all. Do ask her questions by PM if she had time and will allow it. She is an amazing asset on this Forum.
Iggy, I will say in the case of my brother while he was in one end of Cali and I in the other the GOOD news was that the US Bank was in both our cities big time. Once they knew his assets they were all "personal banker at your service" on this and the man who helped me through EVERYTHING, Dan, was kind and was worth his weight in GOLD. I will say it was a tough year, esp the first six months, but once things were arranged it all went well.
PS as far as K. saying "I am also executor of the will", she meant she DID have an attorney do her POA with her and her Dad. And that was just an add on. I was concerned it might be one of those online thingies I warn about.
How did you have Dads POA done? Immediate upon him signing the papers to make it effective? Even if it is, deafness does not make a person incompetent. If a doctor is needed to declare Dad, then its Springing and not in effect until dad is declared incompetent.
getting added on to a bank as a POA (while the principal is still alive) can be very hard at times. We made the mistake of not adding my brother and I on as POA' s onto the actual banks until after my dads mental and physical decline. We have an executed POA document and letter of being incapable of doing his own banking from his doctor, but some banks are making it a real hassle. I read somewhere that some people have gone to the courts in some cases to get the courts to force banks to comply. I havent had time to reach that stage yet. But apparently that can work , the states do want legitimate POAs to be able to conduct necessary banking business.
Having a letter from the doctor saying he could not conduct his own banking was of some help with some banks. I found the banks vary in their scrutiny.