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No. That's my first reaction. Tell your sister to sell that condo to help pay. And grandson too should help. But I'm aware that won't happen. Second thought is if you can afford it, by all means pay half the bill. At least you have a chance to keep the peace within the family. So its basically your call. But sis never ever should have used mom's money like that. If you provided help to mom over the last 20 years, you can consider she used your money as well.
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earlybird Aug 2020
Peace in the family? How about the dishonest sister who is trying to use her mom and her sister?? Mother had money for her long term care, now what, put the responsibility on her the sister? I don't think so!!! Not trying to be rude here, liked most of your reply, mstrbill but I am angry that sister was dishonest, sneaky, and irresponsible. There are lots of people like this. My own brother who lives overseas since retirement tried to bully me into giving him an inheritance after my dear father died. I immediately consulted a dear lawyer friend and put a Life Estate on the deed for my mother. I told him all her possessions including house and money are hers and for her care if needed. Our relationship has not been the same since, yelling at me , telling me he can take me to court, I told him go right ahead. They will be on my side, never took me, but his words are still fresh in my mind. Be strong, you will have no regrets, I don't.
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The short answer is no, but I sure can identify with the situation. My mom gave my sister small amounts of money over years for bills. Then as POA she mishandled mom's money. When confronted she would lash out, cry, and play the martyr. So . . . is your sister meeting your mother's needs and treating her well? If so, you can be the daughter to bring takeout from mom's favorite restaurant, have a visit, and go home. If not, you have choices to make, but need to find answers to some questions. The other replies have covered those. At first look, it sounds like sister and her son don't know how to responsibly handle money. Are they trustworthy? I don't want to read my own experience into your situation.
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MaryNTN Aug 2020
I somehow didn't mention that the "small amounts through the years" totally drained all of mom's assets leaving her only with Social Security.
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No. It is my understanding that once you choose to pay for some things, creditors might assume that you are accepting responsibility for any and all other financial liabilities.
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This is exactly why  my brother and I took care of moms need while dealing with dementia, because we couldn't trust my sister.  In the end after mom passed there was enough money left to split between all 5 of us instead of nothing. Good Luck
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Has the gifting transaction been reported on the proper IRS and state tax forms? If not that is another reason you would want to stay away as far as you can from this situation. You probably should consult your own attorney.
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Your sister squandered the money for your mother's care. I would like to see your mother ask you for help.
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Maryjann Aug 2020
Is that said sarcastically? I am assuming so because asking for money is what condo sister is trying to get mom to do.
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You really need the short answer here: absolutely NOT. The money for her care is in your sister’s hands. Stand your ground.
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I would ask for an accounting of the money. How much money was your sister given and what been spent. I suppose since your mother was living with your sister, that is an expense that your sister incurred. Agreeing on what that expense is would likely be difficult to agree on. You could post that question here to get an idea.

Short of that one obsticle, the money your mother gave to your sister should be used for her care. When the money is gone, then the problem for how to care for your mother can be discussed.

Based on what you have said, your sister will likely become combative so be prepared. Simply tell her you want an accounting of the money. If she is the Trustee, then it is part of the role. Tell her you are not willing to put up any amount without full disclosure. You can always pitch in but I would not agree to anything until you have more information.

You may also want to assess the situation at your sisters home and your mothers condition. Is it possible your sister just does not want to take care of your mother any longer? Do you have input into where your mother will go?

If you are being asked to pony up 1/2 the cost, then you need to be more involved, if you want to be.
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No
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OK, you do not say when your Mom moved in with Sis and did this action. That is crucial. Your Mom now needs more care than your sister can provide. So the questions are:
Firstly: When did Mom do this action? Was it years ago, with Sister providing care for Mom for years now, something she can no longer do? Or was this recent? If Sister did this years ago, and provided years of care, this was at least financially probably a free trade.
However..............
I am assuming you understand about Medicaid lookback? It is 5 years in most states and gifting to your sister of this amount of assets would preclude your Mom receiving care aid from the State for many years. So again, timing is crucial here. When did this gifting occur. If you are so lucky as to be in California (I don't know about others) the lookback is two years only.
You say you supported your mother for 20 years without help from your sister. And that the money your mother gifted your sister was to provide for her old age. This was very unwise. No one knows the future, and the sister now has no money.
Sadly, because of what your mother DID with her assets she now has none for her old age. THAT is not the fault of anyone but her own awful decision, whether well meant or not. She now has nothing. I don't know how much money you have, but your own assets are now in the state where you are about to make your OWN decisions about what YOU will have for YOUR OWN old age? I hope you won't now make the mistakes your mother made, by giving your assets to your mother. I cannot know if you are a multimillionaire or not. If you are not you don't have the money to give.
This leave the question right back where it was. It is not that you would not WANT to pay for your mother. It is more that you cannot. It is not that your sister doesn't want to CARE for your mom. It is more that she cannot. So here the three of you are.
I am hoping the assets gifting happened more than 5 years ago, so that Mom will be able to get funds for the state to live, but it will not be in some Assisted Living but more a nursing home that accepts State funds in payment. They are few and far between these days.
I am so sorry for where this has landed the three of you. I think all of you must be very unhappy. But the decisions made for the last 20 years have put all three of you in a really bad place. I hope others may have some answer I do not. I wish you much luck.
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Hang on until we have more information.

Suppose mother moved in with sister two, ten, fifteen, even twenty years ago. OP states s/he has provided all financial needs, but we don't know what that covers. Let alone why the mother has no pension, no income of her own.

The son could pay rent for the condo, no?

We don't know when the grandson's debt was paid off, or whether we're talking about bail bonds or previously promised college tuition fees.

And if sister is asking OP for half the new care fees, who's paying the other half?

The point is not that the OP is wrong to refuse, the OP may be absolutely right; but that we don't *know* what the history is.
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Your mother moved in with your sister when?
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I would not pay and I would be calling the authorities because what your sister did is a crime.

Get her and her son prosecuted for the financial exploitation of a vulnerable senior and theft that they have committed.

Sorry but your sister is not a nice person to do this to her mom.
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NO! Is sister POA because if so she has taken advantage of her position. She is going to have a big problems if Mom needs Medicaid within the 5 years this all happened. The sale of the house should have gone for Moms care. Is the condo in Moms name? If so it WILL have to be sold for her care if Medicaid ever gets involved. Yes, Mom would be allowed her house in normal conditions but I think there is a cap on how much its worth. Like, you can keep a 200k house but not a 500k house. 500k can pay for a lot of care. And using her IRA to pay off grandson's debt!

Just curious and you don't have to answer...why did u need to support your Mom when she had an IRA and a 500k home. She could have sold the home and used the proceeds to help pay for an apartment.

What I see here is sis seems to be able to get everything she wants from Mom. She took Mom in just so she could get the house and now realizes that Mom takes more care then she wants to give. Oh well, Sis has made her bed. Whether the condo is in Moms name or Sisters, she is going to have to sell it and poor little grandson will need to live somewhere else. She has made her bed. You are not responsible to get her out of a mess she has gotten herself into. And at this point, thats what I would tell her and Mom. You cared for Mom for 20 years, you got nothing for it. Sister got the IRA and the house. Its up to her to figure out how to pay for Moms care.

I have a feeling you are the easy going daughter. Would not think about doing what your sister has. You need to now stand up for yourself even if it means being estranged. I feel you have probably allowed yourself to be taken advantage of because it was easier than fighting or it really wasn't that important at the time. Your sister has the means of fixing her problem. Sell the Condo. Good Luck.
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Sell the Condo to pay for Mom's care.
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Who is the "Anyone" who confronts sister? Have you had her to a lawyer? If not, why not?

And I echo the question as to why you have been paying for ANY of your mother's expenses when such blatant financial abuse was taking place.
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Absolutely not! Time for sis to start backpedaling. This is going to cause mom problems with paying for Care for a long time.

If there isn't money to pay for Care, then sis gets to keep providing the care.

Call APS to report financial exploitation.

At least you are in California, are mom and sis as well? Medicaid look back in CA is 2.5 years elsewhere 5 years.
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Isthisrealyreal Aug 2020
I think that it is unfortunate that California only has a 2.5 year look back. It makes this kind of theft at the taxpayers expense much easier.
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No.

In addition, I might call APS to report sis's financial abuse of your mother
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Why did you agree to pay for your mother's financial needs over the past 20 years? How long ago was the house sale? And the money all went to a pricey condo that is in your sister's name and lived-in by her son (your mother's grandson)? How much money from IRA monies was used to pay off the debt of this grandson?

Your profile states that your mother is already in AL. If your mother needs money to pay for AL, then your sister will have to sell the condo. I assume it is in her name?

Stand firm, say NO, and don't let any cajoling on the part of "Dear Mama" sway you. Remember, your mother allowed YOU to pay for her financial needs while she was giving away so much money to your sister and your nephew.
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Absolutely not! The condo should be sold to pay for your Mother’s care. It seems you have provided for your Mother for quite some time.

Does your sister have power of attorney? There may be an issue if eventually the money is used up and you have to file for Medicaid. It would be wise to consult an elder law attorney to determine what would be in your Mother’s best interest.
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Nope. Not a dime.
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