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My mom has dementia and lives in memory care. Recently she met another man while at an event in the community. This man lives in the assisted living side of the community. She says he works and has his own car. As her guardian, she gave him my phone number so he can get permission to take her out on a date. He has called and left me a message, but I haven't talked to him yet. I also haven't called the facility because I'm trying to determine the best way to go about it. Today she let me know that he surprised my mom by paying for a haircut and color at the onsite salon. I thought it was very sweet, but I am also concerned with where this will all lead. My mom is a very sneaky woman and has a history of trying to escape the facilities she has been at and being hypersexual. She has already made comments about wanting to have sex with this man. Because of this, I'm not comfortable with him being able to take her out of the community to go on a date. I wouldn't mind if they communicated and spent time with each other on-site. However, can I put boundaries on where they can go? The community is fairly large and the assisted living apartments are not in the main building where she lives. I don't want to stop her from having somewhat of a life but I'm very nervous that she will try to talk him into taking her out even when it is not allowed or get into trouble. Has anyone dealt with this? Any advice on the best way to handle this situation?

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Yes would be nice to know how Jenn handle this and the response from the facility. It helps others that may have the same problem.
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Smile1 Feb 2023
I agree with the Nay sayers. Mom absolutely can not go out with him, needs to be protected and authorities notified. Also, since mom is in memory care, you may find she made the whole thing up. My mom always thought one man or another asked her to marry him. Be vigilant.
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JennMc: I'll be a naysayer to this man wanting to date your mother with dementia. In my honest opinion, this man footing the bill at the hair salon was anything but "sweet." I would have been suspect from the get go and THAT would have been a red flag warning; I am always an advocate for elders. How very odd that this man, residing in assisted living, holds a job. Good grief - there is much to this story line that just doesn't add up. Tell this guy to take a hike.
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Just say no to off site dating. If he is a gentleman and has honorable intentions he will accept that. If not, he will move on.
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This drives me nutty! OP has not come back to answer questions or comment in any way. Maybe she was taking a poll. When this happens posters under the guise of being helpful start to question or put down others suggestions. Then the overall discord and spite comes out of so many! It gets ugly fast!

Leaving it alone. There is no contest of who's opinions are right!
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NeedHelpWithMom Jan 2023
Glad, I feel the same.

I wonder if they forgot what website they posted the question on, or forgot about the question altogether, no longer interested or simply busy.

Even more puzzling to me are the very old questions that are routinely answered.
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Trust your gut instincts. For perspective, let me rephrase what you wrote:
I don’t trust the creepy male neighbor who’s suddenly paying for hair cut for a flirtatious woman with dementia in memory care and wants to take her somewhere to be alone or do “something that’s not allowed.”

Screams red flags everywhere.
The good news is that she seeks your permission so you can say NO. And yes, you do want to stop risky or unhealthy forms of entertainment, even if it disappoints or limits mom. I’d be on the phone with management in a New York minute.
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How about meeting with the facility director and a Geriatric Psychiatrist in an effort to get a group consensus? BTW, isn't Mom's memory care a "locked facility?"
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lealonnie1 Jan 2023
Why on earth does this daughter need a 'group consensus' from some shrink and a facility director? Who cares what they think? Anyone in their right mind would put the kabosh on this 'date' the predator has in mind! There are plenty of women for him to choose from in AL..........nobody but a predator would be wanting to take a woman with DEMENTIA out on a date off the premises.
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If I were you, I wouldn't even consider giving her permission to "date" this man. I have a friend who is a nurse in an assisted living facility and she tells me about various male predators who take advantage of women they meet there. Your mother is in memory care because she needs care and protection, and this is the time to protect her.
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As stated by others I would wonder why, why would you want to take someone who has memory issues out? Me, I would not let my siblings take my Daddy out from the MC he was in. Not because I didn't trust them, I didn't trust my Daddy and what he was telling people. I had to be tough with my Daddy and my siblings they understood that but I was afraid they would believe him and not me. Also, if mom is an escape artist - YIKES the answer would be no! How is he going to get her back to the facility if she starts screaming or having a fit in public? I think your best bet is yes they could see each other there at the facility, in public and not in their private rooms.
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My concern would be not being able to know for sure why he is in assisted living. There are those who personally choose AL simply because they want an easier lifestyle all the way to those who stay there past the time they should have moved to MC or SNF. I would question his motives... it could be anywhere from wanting to keep company to looking for a sexual partner. He also has no way of knowing for sure her limitations or motives. I would question why someone in AL would pursue someone in MC unless they were friends before she moved to MC. As others have said I would never give permission to take her away from MC for the safety of both of them. While you can not control everything they do, taking her out of the MC opens up so many more risks of danger. Your concern is valid.
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This is potentially a high risk situation for everyone, your mother, her " date", the facility and, you as the " responsible PCG/ POA) for her.

My best and shortest answer to your question would be " No". If she is in memory care, she has significant care needs and, her boundaries could easily be violated. Confer with her PCP, the facility staff and, an elder care attorney . It is for her safety and well being that " dating" not be on the agenda. Even who visits her should be closely monitored for her safety and well being.
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Contact the management / administrative immediately.
Do not wait.
Absolutely, do not allow him to take her out of the facility / off the premises.

Tell management about your mom's past inclinations / behavior.
Find out as much as you can about this man. He likely does this / reaches out / wants interactions (sexual? touching? what?) with others there.

While it sounds 'cute' for a person to have a 'relationship' as they age, it is quite another situation when a person is in memory care ... (woman, vulnerable, unable to make healthy decisions in her best interest AND SAFETY), it isn't cute - it is an alarm.

A person in memory care cannot set limits or know when to set limits.
I am surprised though, if your mom is in memory care that she was able to give that man your phone number. She apparently has the cognitive functioning to do that.

I appreciate your concern and sensitivity to your mom - and not wanting to 'cut her off' completely of social connections.

* I would say it depends on how often staff checks in on her.
* Is she locked in her room? Does she share a room?
* Can anyone 'just' walk into her room, like this man?

Would you consider the three of you going out AS FRIENDS? [If you encourage this, which might be okay ... he will pursue her more when you are not there.)

These situations are NOT new to management / administrators.
Ask how they handle it with others.

Likely, there is no cookie cutter answer.
You must talk to management and perhaps meet the man.
Anyone in assisted living is still VERY FUNCTIONAL in many areas so there is clearly a major difference here - w your mom being in a memory care division.

Gena / Touch Matters
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Wherever my mom lived (in her 90s) she would always search for a new man in her life. It started in independent living where both were with mild dementia and he still drove. They lived together to save on rent until he passed.
It started again when she was still in IL but both later moved to different memory cares. I would bring her to visit him since his guardians never drove him anywhere. In both places, they were locked down. I would have to ring a doorbell and he could not leave. (My mom could leave because I was her guardian and on record to remove her, especially for her specialists).
During visits, I would be somewhere reading in the common room so mom and her BF could communicate. It was sweet but I never allowed her to be in his room. Both were just finding a way to snuggle.
Your mom wanting sex was similar to my mom in the early stage with her live in. If you move her, she may do it again.
You might just want to be present however, talk to staff. They encounter this scenario frequently. You might want to try with him just visiting but not taking her out. Howvever my experience with MCs is that if there is an entertainer, most residents meet in one big place in the facility.
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No I would not allow him to take your mother out of her unit. That’s a huge red flag. I would also discourage this friendship. What is in this relationship for him? I would alert the unit that you do not want him visiting her. She will forget about him in time.

It is sad but this part of your mother’s life is over because she is not capable of making sound decisions anymore. If it was another resident in her unit I don’t think I’d have a problem with it. But this smells big time.

Your responsibility is to be sure she is kept safe. That’s why you placed her in this facility in the first place.
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I think this depends on a few things…how incapacitated is mom mentally? Obviously she is not that far gone if she can remember phone numbers, obviously remembers daughter and her guardianship , etc. so just because she isn’t able to live on her own ..perhaps leaving stove on and forgetting to lock doors and unable to manage her money doesn’t mean she is incompetant completely. As for the man, don’t condemn him before you meet him. Talk to him alone and also observe with your mother. How does he treat her? Is he just a sweet lonely old man , perhaps who has been married but lost his wife and now is lost being on his own? Perhaps he merely wants companionship …and mom meets this need. I am doubtful that the facility puts the MC folks in bright orange jumpsuits or hangs a sign on them indicating their deficits so he may not have realized her issues on first meeting. My dad had dementia but when out and about could fool people ..even doctors. He always had interesting stories to tell. Unfortunately he also loved to leave our side when out and talk to strangers , luckily most I don’t think noticed other than that he had no social awareness so would keep up a conversation long after the people wanted to get away! I always felt like I should have printed cards to hand them explaining his dementia and apologizing if he was bothering them and thanking them for their patience. We mostly had good experiences with that , except for one woman at a mall that insisted that Security detain him when he spoke to her and her young daughter. Anyway, perhaps your mother can still be charming as well. So, meet with him and see what he is about ..explain your concerns and go from there. Can keep them “on campus” ..he could order a meal delivered or if it’s a place with a cafe or the like treat her there. It could be that they can enjoy time with each other and share some happiness in their late years. I surely wouldn’t just move her to a new place which could be jarring to her. If indeed this guy is creepy and you get bad vibes then you can bar his visits ..which would also likely mean that your mom will be disallowed from going to the mutual events.
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BurntCaregiver Jan 2023
@Mymomsthebest

The OP's mother is far gone enough that she cannot live in the assisted living area of the facility and had to be put into the memory care residence.
If the mother enjoys this man's company she should be allowed to see him and spend time with him.
At the memory care residence and under the supervision of the memory care staff. They can spend time together in the common areas of the memory care only. Nowhere private or even semi-private.
The mother has dementia and is also hyper-sexual. That's a disaster waiting to happen.
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Your mom is not in her right mind and can no longer make decisions that are in her best interest. If she could, you would not be her guardian. No, I don't think she should be able to leave the memory care unit with a man. He can go into memory care to visit her, but I would tell the facility that he does not have permission to leave with her.

He obviously has issues of his own, otherwise what dialog and interaction could he possibly be having with someone who is advanced enough in their dementia to be in memory care.

Let them be friends and let them visit each other in memory care.
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TouchMatters Jan 2023
This man has issues - as you say. He is in assisted living and likely has some physical disability / disabilities. Perhaps he had a stroke. We do not know. This doesn't make him a villian.

* Yes and No. I, too, am alarmed as daughter's mom is in memory care. although she was able to give his man her daughter's phone number to call to ask if okay to go out ... so she has a lot more cognitive ability than some / most in memory care. This is a very high level of functioning for someone in a memory care unit (from my experience).

This isn't an easy answer to a complicated sensitive issue as people, with dementia, age. It is really sort of heartbreaking in many ways. Gena
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Not a good idea for Mom to leave her facility.
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This was an event they met at. So yes, they may combine the two units if there is some kind of entertainment.

I would not move Mom at this point. All you need to do is make the director aware of this man. Then request that he not be allowed to see her in her Unit or visa versa. He not be allowed to remove her for any reason. To me its logical to wonder why this man wants a relationship with a woman who is suffering from Dementia. There really is no reason for a person from the AL being in the MC unit. Unless, they have a spouse there, a already friend or relative.

You may find out Mom isn't the only one he is trying to "court".
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Does AL&MC usually share common areas? Aren't memory care staff supposed to be with the residents all the time?
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freqflyer Jan 2023
Catskie62, it depends on the facility. My Dad had free range of the building which included Memory Care and Assisted Living during the day, but not at night. If Dad wanted to go outside, he wasn't allowed unless family was with him, or a regular friend visitor.
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As a Lewy Body dementia patient who struggles to understand safety..my moms doctor told us when mom wanted to date a guy at her place…”take away all her checks and credit cards…this man may be looking for money”. We eventually moved her away from him. I am POA she gets $20 to keep on her.
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I have not dealt with this. However, I had a friend who had severe dementia, who met a guy who also had dementia. Both were in the MC ward. Both were members of the sheriff's department, but 2 different counties and did not know each other prior to meeting in the MC ward. His family still had connections in the sheriff's office and vetted her out. Surprisingly, both specialized in the same area of the sheriff's department of their respective counties so they had a lot in common. The two friends were inseparable and both were invited together to family events hosted by their respective families. They never moved in together. nor did the staff at the MC allow either to visit the other in their room.

My opinion is that anyone in MC, does not have the mind to make sound decisions, sexual or otherwise. In addition, based on the people I see in my Mom's floor, none of them have the capability to carry very much more than a superficial friendship. I've heard of women and men exposing themselves in MC.

I would alert the Director of the facility about both of them. I probably would also try and find another facility for your Mom, unless the facility is really, really a good match for her. I would put him on the "do not allow" guest list. No, he should NOT remove your Mom from MC for any reason. When your Mom goes to the salon, I'm assuming that someone goes with her and stays with her the entire time she is out of MC area. If not, I would think that would be a violation of the MC agreement.

I'm not sure that I'd return his call. He's a predator.

As for your Mom, knowing that she is sneaky, I would wait until she asks before discussing anything about him. For sure, when asked, tell her that he never contacted you. Whenever she mentions him, try to respond to her as if he was a casual acquaintance. Hopefully, that will not set off the "escape" bells.

..and start looking for another MC facility. One MC facility that I know of, kicked someone out of the facility because their desire to escape was overwhelming the staff. Hopefully, your Mom will not get to that point. If you have to move your Mom to another room so that someone from the outside cannot visit her through the window, do it. This is way too scary situation.
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I would find a new facility for my mom immediately. I wouldn't put up with that crap. If your mother in in a MC facility, I would assume it is because she doesn't have the mental capacity to take care of herself. For damn sure that includes being in a relationship with a man she met at an event. Our neighbor asked me if it was ok for him to call my mom and talk to her on a regular basis. I said sure. Then when he moved, he asked me if he could take her and show her his new home. I said sure, as long as I accompany you! He got the message instantly and stopped calling. IMO, a man that is that interested in a woman with full blown dementia is screwed up somehow. It is worth noting that the old man that wanted to take my mom to his house retired from being a Realty appraiser and the value of my mom's house is HIGH. I smelled a RAT.
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My suggestion would be to meet the man, and get some idea of who he is and what he is like (eg the work and driving issues). Then unless it sounds a lot lot better, scare the pants off him by telling an (exaggerated?) story of M’s past misdeeds and escapes. Say the law will be on to him if anything goes wrong, and he could be in serious trouble. Much better for him to stick to safe meetings on site. Getting him to back off is much less stressful than trying to control the facility or M.
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Peggy has a point. This topic was discussed not long ago about relationships in MC and AL. By law, you cannot make these people do what they don't want to. And if both consent, not sure if you keep them from having sex. As my daughter says, it happens. Now I don't want a series of replies saying how wrong this is or it should be considered rape or what about those who are bedbound. Just saying what my daughter has told me. Their are laws protecting the rights of the residents. Dementia or not.

But, I too would wonder if Mom is telling the complete truth. I would also wonder why a man in AL has an interest in someone who is has Dementia. There are ALs that allow those with early Dementia in. Maybe he is in the early stages. As guardian u have more control than a POA. Use it.

I would talk to the director and ask that this man be kept away from your mother. He is not allowed to visit her in the MC unit or her visit him in the AL unit. If there is a mixed social get together that to ask the staff to keep an eye on them. Actually if possible, deter him from being anywhere near Mom. And, please do not allow him to pay for her hair appts. And hope she forgets him.
Maybe a good thing would be to call this man into the meeting after talking to the director first. This way everyone is on the same page. Tell him your sorry, but as Mom guardian, you cannot give him permission to see your Mom. Tell him because of Moms history, you can't allow it. That you would appreciate that he does not pursue any kind of relationship with her. It will only cause you and the facility problems.

This also puts the staff on alert concerning this man. My Mom has a man pursue her at her AL. He told me he was caring for her. I told him he was not. TG my Mom, with Dementia, didn't like men or being touched. Even with Dementia I think she remembered this man from town and he had the reputation of being a dirty old man. I work with Visting Nurses and he was a client. He was always trying something with them. Then he was in the same Rehab with Mom. I told the SW to keep him away from her. She said he has a right to be anywhere in the common areas. I said true but if he bothers Mom, remove her. One of the aides came over and said, two aides had to go into his room because of the things he tried so on her shift, she will make sure he was nowhere near my Mom. I was really afraid Mom would belt him one and she would be blamed for being aggressive.
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Communication with the folks that are responsible for your mother's safety is very important. You should regard them as your partner.

When you know of some risk, change in behavior, and anything that could go wrong, the folks at the memory care facility must know immediately, just as they should keep you informed of the same. You must alert those in charge.

You must get their advice. You must share information. They are professionals and have experienced everything under the sun. Perhaps they'll say that in this case this guy is okay and a sweetheart, or that he is a predator with a reputation of molesting vulnerable, easy, brain damaged women. Are his initials S.T.D.?
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ConnieCaretaker Jan 2023
"Are his initials S.T.D.?".........................................Hahahahahahahahahaha!
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For the past 10 years, there’s been an increasing waste toward letting residents, even those with dementia, “date.” Sandra Day O Connor walked in on her demented husband holding another woman’s hand; she knew at least some making out was going on, but he was happier, she said, less lonely.

In your case, I’d say no to taking mom off the facility, but surely there are gardens or common areas or activities?
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NeedHelpWithMom Jan 2023
Sandra Day O'Connor did help to raise awareness of this awful disease. I admire her for that.
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Your Mom is in Memory Care. I think that it is entirely inappropriate to trust her care into the hands of someone, no matter how well meaning, you do not know, and moreover someone in ALF. That they are currently friends is very sweet, and I am certain she will be appropriately monitored during their visits.
I would go at once to the admin so they are informed of this budding relationshp. The visits, given your Mom is in memory care, should likely be charparoned. This is for the safety of all.
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JennMc, it is not unusual for a person who has dementia to make up stories. I would arrange a meeting with the Adm Staff to gather more information regarding this man. Find out who he really is. He could be an innocent employee that your Mom has a crush on. Or not so innocent.

One thing that caught my eye was when you wrote "She says he works and has his own car." Really now, why would an able bodied person who works and still drive need to live in Assisted Living? That doesn't add up.
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lealonnie1 Jan 2023
My thoughts exactly! He works and drives but lives in AL???
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This is a first for me, a memory care person being able to go out of the home with someone in AL?

My step-mother is in MC, she is in lock down, and she is a runner.

You need to have a conversation with the admin of the home.

There is something fishy here, does not compute.
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Absolutely not, and I'd be having a serious conversation with the facility administrators to know how it is that the MC residents are able to meet the AL residents at all. Memory Care should never be open to anyone else.
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